We can fit an ALK from a WRX on our cars, right? If so, then I've found a problem with the control arm bushings prothane makes
Here's a shot of what the control arm on my Legacy looks like:
Notice how the blue section is larger than the red section. There's a taper there. Now, with that in mind look at these prothane bushings:
I purchased these to push into the stock mount. They were a lot cheaper than a ALK, but they provided stiffer bushings. The problem is that the sleeve inside the bushing has no taper! They're one size all the way through. They match the size of the "large" end before the taper down. Here's a shot of the stock mount showing the taper:
So my question is, at some point did subaru get rid of the taper design? The ONLY way these bushings would fit on the control arm would be to remove the taper all together. Did prothane mess this up?
I have the Whiteline setup on mine, and I cannot remember any issues like that when I put them on, but that was three years ago. When I get home in a day or two I can look at the pair of leftover Energy Suspension bushings I have at home in the garage. You have me wondering too.
93forestpearl wrote:I have the Whiteline setup on mine, and I cannot remember any issues like that when I put them on, but that was three years ago. When I get home in a day or two I can look at the pair of leftover Energy Suspension bushings I have at home in the garage. You have me wondering too.
Thanks Dan! I'd really appreciate it.
It just doesn't make any sense. I had sold these to a fellow member, and he couldn't make them work (this was before I knew about the taper). When I got them back, I tried on my Impreza and it was the same story. So now I'm wondering - wtf?
No prob. The owner might shut the plant down after tomorrow for the rest of the week, which sucks because its about $100 a day not in my pocket going towards a new shell, but it gives me time to work on stuff. I can look at those En. Sus. ones and pop one of my Whiteline ALK's off and look at it, since the crossmember is dropped. It's lame being 70 miles from my garage during the week...
Also, which car are you trying to put this on? There were a lot of subtle little things they changed from '92 to '93. For instance, I kept trying to pull a wheel bearing out of the outside of the hub on my '92 until I noticed it comes out the inside on the earlier ones. Hopefully I didn't tweak the knuckle.
Dug into it last night. I found that neither my Energy Suspension bushings have that taper nor do the Whiteline ALK's.
I couldn't get the inner sleeve off the control arm from the ALK. Whiteline must use Chinese steel or something else crappy. They rusted REALLY bad in the three years they were on there. The three-jaw puller wouldn't even get them off. I need to throw a bunch of heat at it. If it is the same OD, I might have to use the En. Sus. bushings in them.
I did some searching on the whiteline site, and the part numbers are definitely different between the GC and GD parts listing. I can only guess that subaru switched to a non tapered control arm with the WRX.
P/N's (non race versions only)
GC and Legacy: KCA319A or KCA361
WRX: KCA359 or KCA362
I'll have to email whiteline and see if the tube inside the bushing is the same between the two.
Running the WRX part on the Legacy seems to be rather unsafe if you ask me. There's a lot of stress on just one small section of the control arm...
93forestpearl wrote:As long as it fits tightly on the larger section, you are still putting the same bending moment on the shaft that it mounts to.
It just seems kind of unsafe to me, concentrating all that down to such a small section of the shaft. It looks like a lot of people run these, and I've never heard of an issue, but still....
n2x4 wrote:
It just seems kind of unsafe to me, concentrating all that down to such a small section of the shaft. It looks like a lot of people run these, and I've never heard of an issue, but still....
I didn't look at that control arm pic close enough. I thought you were talking about the black portion to the threaded portion. I didn't see the little tapered part. My bad.
Subaru must have changed that. With the larger pin ID, it would be able to move around in there. It looks like I'll be cleaning up the Whiteline pins and reusing them.
Have you thought about getting the Group-N bushings for it? You could also get the outback mounts and make your own ALK. Looks like they would be about $96 for the pair from RalliSpec.
I didn't look at that control arm pic close enough. I thought you were talking about the black portion to the threaded portion. I didn't see the little tapered part. My bad.
Subaru must have changed that. With the larger pin ID, it would be able to move around in there. It looks like I'll be cleaning up the Whiteline pins and reusing them.
So you're saying that the whiteline sleeve fits the control arm tightly? It's hard to tell from your picture. I'm still confused then
Ya, it fits tightly. The little gap that is there is from the step down to the threaded part. I haven't had a chance to get a new torch since mine is junk and I had my fourth Christmas today .
I'm really annoyed that those Whiteline pins rusted soooo bad. I might try and make some sleeves to take up the slack in the WRX pins. I need to talk to the shop boss at school and see if I can use a lathe for that taking up about an hours time. The difference is .148".
Another possible option might be to get GD wagon front control arms. The front bushing would need to be messed with though.
I did some searching on the whiteline site, and the part numbers are definitely different between the GC and GD parts listing. I can only guess that subaru switched to a non tapered control arm with the WRX.
no, nothing changed with the alk itself. The GD part has a different number because it includes spacers and hardware to move the subframe out of the way.
I bought a KCA359 because it was all they had in stock. It worked fine on my 93 and now it's on my new car.
jamal wrote:
no, nothing changed with the alk itself. The GD part has a different number because it includes spacers and hardware to move the subframe out of the way.
I bought a KCA359 because it was all they had in stock. It worked fine on my 93 and now it's on my new car.
So then you're saying that the WRX arm has the same taper as well, and that the Prothane sleeve is a POS hunk of junk???
Well, then I need to email Prothane now. They have explaining to do.
Dan, if you do end up making some new prothane sleeves, let me know if you would be interested in making 4, instead of just 2
We'll see. It wouldn't happen for a few weeks, as I don't have access to the shop at school until the semester starts.
I might be able to salvage those Whiteline sleeves though.
Do you already have those Prothane bushings on hand? If so, do you have a caliper you can measure the ID of them to compare with the Engery set I have sitting here?
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