legacycentral bbs

This is kind of a continuation from this previous thread. I am doing a six speed swap and since I have a stand alone ECU I want to convert the speedometer to elctronic so I can calibrate it properly....and for the "coolness" factor of having the speedo & tach do a needle sweep on startup.

I ended up finding a 92 Turbo Legacy electronic gauge cluster from the UK. What that meant was the speedometer face was in MPH! If you are wanting to do a similar conversion, these gauge clusters can be kind of difficult to find as the electronic ones only came in the turbo models.

The gauge cluster is not a direct swap and will require some wiring modification and other tweaking to get it all to work properly. I spent yesterday identifying the pin outs from the US Legacy gauge cluster and compared it to the electronic gauge cluster. One thing to note is that the 90 MY gauge cluster is unique and has slightly different wiring than all the other model years. There are several pins that have been swapped around. The electronic gauge cluster pins are mostly the same, but there are a few key and critical differences. Those pins will need to be swapped. In addition, the electronic gauge cluster does not have the key chime in it. I'm not sure if and where the key chime is located in the overseas Legacies, but it's not in the gauge cluster. What I plan to do is desolder the key chime from the flexible circuit board and hard wire it up to the existing wiring and just mount the key chime some place behind the dash.

I will end up having a hybrid gauge cluster because I will be using the front fascia from my 90 Legacy. This will retain the same position of all the existing warning lights, and keep the auto gear selector lights. I plan to use this later for either a DCCD lock indicator or for some other purpose. I will be using the tach, speedometer, back housing, and flexible circuit board from the electronic gauge cluster. All of it should fit together fine and work fine.

The next challenge is figuring out how to roll the odometer to match the mileage in my car.

Here are pictures of the electronic gauge cluster.

http://main.experiencetherave.com/subar ... meterswap/

Also, here is the pin out comparison between the US and electronic gauge cluster. (don't mind the coloring, as those are just some of my notes)

http://main.experiencetherave.com/subar ... n_Out.xlsx

I'll update this thread when I have more info/details. I plan to do a test and hook up the tach & speedo into the stand alone ECU to ensure they work properly before I do the 6spd swap.

More info on the differences between the 91 turbo cluster and the edm cluster would be nice if you can find that stuff out. Is it possible to use the electronic cluster with a stock ecu and still provide the ecu with the speed reading it requires?

Look at the Excel spreadsheet, that will show you the difference.

You can use the electronic cluster, however you would need some way to calibrate it. You'd need to have the signal from the speed sensor go to the ECU & gauge cluster. It can be done, but would require some work with the wiring. Once I get done with mine I'll know how easily everything works out.

Ok somebody posted a link to a tutorial on making your own circuitboard to adjust the speedo so that would be the answer.

Josh, will you post a gif of the sweep? I too want to appreciate the "coolness" of it!

Sure thing, when I get everything done I'd be happy to post a video of the sweep.

Do you need the chime for legal reasons or do you just not hate it with the intensity that I do?

Using the auto indicator lights for the DCCD is a cool idea. Are you going to change the markings for the LEDs so that they light up something other than PRNDL?

Are you creating something to perform the sweep? I don't recall any of the early clusters having an ignition-on sweep.

I was excited about no chime. Can't stand it.

evolutionmovement wrote:Do you need the chime for legal reasons or do you just not hate it with the intensity that I do?

Using the auto indicator lights for the DCCD is a cool idea. Are you going to change the markings for the LEDs so that they light up something other than PRNDL?

I have locked my keys in other cars that did not have the key chime, so it's kind of for that reason. I think the likelihood of that happening in the Legacy is probably much slimmer, but it's just something I want to do.


For the time being, I'm going to use the stock DCCPro button light that indicates lock. It would be nice to get a new plastic piece etched with different markings, so that's kind of why I'm just going to use the stock indicator for now, and look into my options to use the gauge cluster for the future.

I'm currently using the gauge cluster's "N" position indicator for a knock light from the ECU.

PhyrraM wrote:Are you creating something to perform the sweep? I don't recall any of the early clusters having an ignition-on sweep.

The tach & speedo sweep are functions of the Link ECU. Currently my tach does a needle sweep, but since the normal speedo is mechanical, the ECU can't control it. With the electronic speedo, the ECU will be controlling it and I can set it to do the needle sweep.

EDIT: I read through your original post a second time and saw you were gonna try to match the mileage.

Does it have to be matched for inspection?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don't know if it necessarily has to match for inspection, but they will record the mileage and I'm sure it would be flagged as odometer tampering if the car was ever to be sold or possibly even appraised.

I got around to doing a check out on the wiring on Friday and all the pins worked as expected. I also fitted the electronic speedo gauge cluster in the car for a "test" run to make sure the Link ECU would work and output the speedometer as expected. Everything went well and worked as expected. The speedo read a little higher than the stock one, so I'll have to tweak the calibration once everything's in.

Here's the lovely mess of wires for the testing

http://main.experiencetherave.com/subar ... G_7438.JPG

And as a teaser of what's to come, here's a video of the speedo sweep.

http://youtu.be/nfwrSF4uczo

One thing I didn't take into account is that every time the speedo sweeps, it ticks the odometer ever so slightly forward. Probably not enough to make a huge difference or for me to not have the speedo sweep setup though.

haha, rad. The tach does the same thing right? so they both sweep at the same speed at the same time?

Yeah, the tach does sweep as well, but I just didn't have it hooked up when I was testing. I can adjust the sweep time, which affects speed. They're timed the same, so once I have everything in, I'll just have to watch it to see that they are both synced together.

Are you planning on getting the temp and gas guage to sweep as well? Or is that not possible?

Danny-G wrote:Are you planning on getting the temp and gas guage to sweep as well? Or is that not possible?

They recieve a different type of signal, so I doubt the Link can support it. Also, the fuel level gauge is very dampened compared to the temp gauge, so a sweep (if possible) would be very slow.

Subscribed to this. Will be going to a standalone system for my rally car soon. Would be nice to incorporate this as well.

Danny-G wrote:Are you planning on getting the temp and gas guage to sweep as well? Or is that not possible?

As PhyrraM pointed out, they get different types of signals and I can't get them to sweep using the Link.

Josh,

The gauge sweep looks fantastic I am wishing that I hadn't sold you the electronic cluster now. Its was really easy to reset the mileage on my JDM car when I converted it from kmph to mph hopefully yours will be as easy.

I can probably source more electronic clusters if anyone wants one send me a pm

Martin

Martin,

I know you may not have wanted to sell it now, but I really appreciate you selling it to me!

Thanks for the feedback/comments on adjusting the mileage. I haven't split open the electronic cluster yet, so once I do that I'll take some pictures.

Well I've finally got to the point in the wiring where I'm ready to start tackling the gauge cluster swap and associated wiring. As mentioned above, I've pretty much got all the pin outs identified, however after reviewing my spreadsheet and confirming which wires I need to swap I noticed something interesting.

The 1990 model year Legacy VSS output appears to go through some sort of signal conditioner or some sort of electronics. The 1991 MY and newer do not have this. The electronics part is actually on the tachometer circuit board. I really don't know what it does, but my assumption is it's some sort of "signal conditioner". You can see pictures of the wiring and differences in these pictures.

http://www.main.experiencetherave.com/s ... spdswap/28

If anyone has any other ideas/thoughts as to what is going on there, please share. I've emailed Rob to see if he has any input, but haven't heard back yet.

Well....it's been a while since I've done anything on the car....but actually longer since I posted anything. I started the prep work on the hybrid gauge cluster back in mid March and got everything done except adjusting the odometer. The circuit board on the back of the electronic speedometer comes off as well as the motor/gear assembly that turns the odometer. Once that motor/gear assembly is off the odometer pretty much free wheels.

Initially I was thinking about using a Lego gear and motor setup to turn the odometer to the correct mileage. However today when I tried that, the gears were different enough that it wasn't going to work well. Next I was going to use a rubber wheel to turn the gear on the odometer, but again I wasn't happy with how things were setup. I got a can of compressed air to play with and sure enough, just the air coming from the can was enough to turn the odometer.

So I setup my air compressor with a regulator to drastically reduce the output pressure (almost to zero), clamped open the air nozzle, and then positioned the nozzle to blow on the odometer gear. This worked extremely well! It was averaging about 1,000 miles per 1 minute & 13 seconds. I estimated that it would take a little over 100 minute to get from the gauge's old mileage of 99,496 miles to my current mileage of 194,841 miles. The actual time was around 110 - 115 minutes.

The air nozzle setup was by far the best setup I thought of! This setup was probably the kindest to the odometer gears since it did not have a direct gear/wheel contact.

Anyway, onto the pictures & video!

Hybrid Electronic Gauge Cluster Prep
Electronic Odometer Adjustment & Final Hybrid Gauge Cluster Assembly

The first video shows the odometer turning over to 110,000 miles
http://youtu.be/lbyftaApffo

The second video shows the odometer turning over to 192,000 miles
http://youtu.be/cYeC0FkYH-w

You can force the numbers to turn with a flathead screw driver or a pick