Complicated battery/starter issue

[Suzie-Q]

Somehow my battery is getting drained, and I am only making a new post because the old ones I found while searching did not involve a major issue with the starter. Sorry this is so long, but there is nothing consistent about the symptoms and the whole story is needed to really get all the necessary info. So, here goes (chronologically):

-Drive several places, car is hot, won't start after getting a few groceries. Starter clicks, but no turn over. Remove starter, tests fine at Schuck's (it was purchased as a re-man 3-4 weeks earlier). Reinstall starter and turn key for kicks; car turns over no problem, without being jumped!!
-Car works fine for a while (~10 days), when I decide to put a new battery in. After new battery is installed, car appears to not have clicking-starter issue, but now the engine tries to crank and cannot fully turn over. After trying several things, the clicking-starter issue crops up in the middle of the not-turning-over problem. We were never able to figure things out, so the car was towed the next day and mechanics determined the the started issue was due to a butt connector under the dash and that the engine issue was actually a camshaft sensor. Car runs fine and I leave with a large bill.
-6 days later, after several errands that day (car is hot), car won't start again (clicks but won't turn over). Upset with the mechanics shop, I try to have them work with me to get this figured out and a mechanic comes to help me. He bangs on the starter with the hammer 7 or 8 times while I have the key turned, and it starts. He explains that the starter components can stick when hot.
-Car runs fine for 3 days. After having been parked for 15 hours (car is cold), car won't start (clicks but won't turn over). Hammer trick does not work. Jumping the car DOES work.
-Car runs fine for 3.5 days. Today: another busy day; car is hot after several errands. Won't start (clicks but won't turn over). Hammer trick does not work again. Car is jumped and starts just fine, again. I take my car to Schuck's to try to figure this out for good. After pulling my battery out, it only has 42% power, which can likely be attributed to having been jumped and driven for 10 mins. The battery was able to charge to 100%, indicating that it should be perfectly fine. The alternator was tested and is fine. Car starts just fine, likely since battery is now at 100% power. We are now figuring this to be a wiring problem somewhere.

Here are my questions: do I honestly have 2 separate issues, one with the starter sticking and one with the battery being drained? Also, I have not personally touched any wiring in years, outside of the battery cables, so I cannot figure out how this just started. Please help!!!

[yazmo]

i had the exactly same problem you have now
its turn out to be the alternator was not charging at is full capacity
i have start changing the battery then the starter to finish changing the alternator since then its never been doing that.

cannot tell for sure its your problem but maybe this can point out a direction.
check your wire from the bettery to the alternator too maybe its broke somewhere.

this is a bad problem i was so piss off when that happen before i drove to my job.

good luck

[evolutionmovement]

First make sure your battery cables are free of corrosion, but I'm thinking it's definitely the alternator. Sounds like you have a diode pack going bad (there are 3). I had the same issue when mine went (at ~250k miles so I knew its time had to be up). Being intermittent, it may test fine, though a lot of guys don't really know how to use the charging system test equipment properly. The good news is that your new battery probably wasn't killed by this failure mode, so all you might need is an alternator. Possibly a starter. Remanufactured starters and alternators are terrible—they have a few parts replaced with cheap components by near slave labor in disgusting conditions (and that's the ones I've seen in the US!) and I think they're designed to have a really high failure rate since the "Lifetime Warranty" they throw at you only covers the part (cheap), but not the labor (money in the seller's pocket). At least with these cars, the starter and alternator are real simple jobs you can probably tackle yourself. But you need to get the charging system fixed before you can tell if the starter is bad or not. In more desperate times, I worked as a mechanic and I've also worked quality control in an electronics lab, as a process engineer in a PC card assembly plant, and I've seen a couple of these rebuilder shops in person, so I'm talking from first hand experience and observation.

[Suzie-Q]

Wonderful new problem. Car lasted an entire day before needing a jump. Now, after driving 1 mile and parking for 10 mins, it won't even jump. it has 700 cold cranking amps.....it is now much more likely to be the starter somehow....

[Deride]

Get the car started and put a multimeter on the alternator power and ground somewhere, if you aren't getting mid to high 14's for volts go buy yourself a new alternator. I would say check the ignition relay but when mine went it didn't even click the starter it would be turn key and nothing.

[evolutionmovement]

There are two possibilities (or a combination, perhaps). 1. The alternator might now be dead and it won't jump now because the car was running on the battery and that's now used up. Did it try to do anything at all when you jumped it? If you left the helper car hooked up and running higher than idle for a few minutes, you should have been able to at least get a chug or two from the starter even with a completely drained battery. If it did, it's likely the battery has been drained.

2. If everything in the car works, headlights are bright, but it just won't even try to turn over, then it's probably the starter. If it is the starter (not unlikely), I still wouldn't be surprised if you have a bad alternator also.

It's little help now, but if you can afford it I always recommend buying new OEM starters and alternators. Although, they're probably also made in China, at least all the parts are new. Otherwise, it might take 3 tries or so to find a rebuilt alternator or starter that will last you at least a little while (I've seen this several times and always on more difficult cars where the customer incurs additional labor charges each time—a disgusting scam. The worst cases were a friend of mine that ate an $800 labor charge for an alternator on his POS Audi twice and a Tercel that went through 3 starters in the space of a month).

[Suzie-Q]

As for the questions coming up so far:
-the alternator was tested yesterday via the battery while running, and was at 14. The lights would work even when the car wouldn't start. But jumping worked 3 of the 4 times in the last week...
-the positive cable is brand new as of 3 days ago, so no corrosion.

After a "new" starter (another reman, only due to lack of time to get a new one at this time), everything seems okay. The old starter heated up reallllly fast after a few test runs, and the gear on the end was not getting pressure. So the whole starter was funky, inside and out. If the no-start issue continues, my next step is the ignition module. The alternator is expensive and appears to have been ruled out due to the awesome power in my battery at any given time, evidenced by the headlights working and full cold-crank power. I cannot figure out why jumping would make my car start if it was genuinely a starter issue, but we will have to go from here and find out.

So, I will see if I can go longer than 6 days without an issue, since that has been my limit as of late. I much appreciate all the help and comments, as they have helped me rule things in and out and will likely be of help in the future!!

[Suzie-Q]

Wow. So I made it another 4.5 days without a starting issue....again....

After a new ignition switch, we really do seem to be okay. It did not start at all with the old ignition, even after a dozen attempts at wiggling the key and wires under the dash. It started right up half a dozen times after the new switch. We may be good, finally.