CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Video & Pics added Mar/31)

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CFK
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by CFK »

There is 156k Miles on the donor car. not sure if its the original motor or not. wish i would have done a compression test before i pulled it. Alright well I'll start with a leakdown and go from there then.

I definitely would like to do as many seals, oil and vacuum lines as there always cracked and brittle. I just wish there was a Kit instead of having to piece together stuff . The local dealers carry nothing in stock and am sick of waiting for stuff from Subarugenuineparts.

Does Beck Arnley make any decent kits I wonder ? Or should I just stick with the OEM stuff ?
Thanks for all the help guys !!!
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by mike-tracy »

Hey Reid, sometimes on ebay the venders put the OEM part number for their aftermarket seal kits. I'm out of time and have to head to work, but here's the number for the felpro full engine reseal kit (including ej22 n/a HG's): HS9854PT. Perhaps you could crossreference that and find a subaru part #. Everything except for the HG's should be the same, right?

I would def recommend OEM over aftermarket when it comes to seals and gaskets.
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Josh Colombo wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2002 10:23 am Wait....I'm confused now.
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by wtdash »

The local dealers carry nothing in stock and am sick of waiting for stuff from Subarugenuineparts.
Call my OEM source. Parts ship w/in a week, even if he has to order them. Prices as good/better than the others (incl. Jamie):
Jason Douglas
Dealer# 140714
Mike Scarff Subaru of Auburn
3025 Auburn way north
Auburn, WA 98002
1-866-456-3025
253-737-1345
Turbo Subies:
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by ScottyS »

You know, I also put a lot of time and effort into my car only to have repeated setbacks (from multiple sources).

In the end, rather than spend a bunch of money on performance parts (e.g. custom engine build), I went with the stock long block setup (just a refresh on everything) and TD04 and 440s along with the whole Robtune package. It honestly is so much fun to drive that I could be very happy with it as-is. It's basically OEM reliable and smooth at this point.

FYI over the years I have replaced most of the lines and hoses, I just bought decent lengths of each type/size I needed and made it all fit. My hose configurations are nothing close to stock.
1991 SS build thread: http://bbs.legacycentral.org/viewtopic.php?t=40430
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by CFK »

Perfect, once I make a list of the part #'s I will try both sources.

Im gonna do alot of researching tonight :smt024

Order the Rob Tune & Clutch. Make a seal / Gasket list and hold off on ordering those until I do a Leakdown. Otherwise I might just order used EJ20G from the importers as they sell them for $1500-$1600 which would probably be cheaper than re-building the EJ22T, but depends on the milage, if they perform a leakdown and have some sort of guarantee. Probably not though.

Just throwing around numerous options in my head. Just praying the leakdown goes well :smt087 I would really like to stick with the 22, as there is replacement for Displacement :!:
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by ScottyS »

Stick with the motors you already have rather than buy another potential headache. If in doubt, have one of your 22T blocks pulled apart, replace rings and bearings, check pistons, rods, crank and deck, check cylinder specs, rehone. I had a local builder that I trust do this for me - I said that I wanted it returned to OEM, nothing special. I think the bearings were an upgrade for the same price, but the rest of the motor went back together. Also had the heads checked and freshened. They assembled the heads back on the block for me with all new seals and gaskets. I think the total was around $1500, mostly labor. I brought them the short block and heads, and they gave me back the short block with the heads bolted on. I reassembled the timing and accessories and put the motor back in the car.

If getting a used 20G, you should do the above anyways.
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by CFK »

Most Definitely, besides. I do like the low end torque of this motor. And im sure those Delta Cams would probably take saome of that away.

I am worried about oil pressure now, did you ever consider the 11mm STI Oil Pump & Killer B pick-up? I was just about to look into that set-up.

I just have to be careful, because once I break out the Visa and start typing, things could get carried Away Very Quickly :smt033
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by CFK »

$ 200 for the oil pick-up seems pricey, but alot cheaper than Re-building another motor :!: Looks very well made.

Oil pump, I might just inspect it, actually use a feeler gauge or whatever you had to do.... this time :roll:

So, Ya. Looking into clutches and WOW, What a $ difference between the Exedy OEM & Stage 1. $177 - $426
$443 for the Stage 1 HD :!:
Figured I maybe should beef up the clutch if im going the TD05 route, but OUCH :shock:
Anyone else have any other brand recommendations ? ACT, SPEC, Exedy seems like the best value, but can the OEM replacement handle that power :?:

So much to research, gonna be on here for days ordering parts before I actually get back in there and pull that motor, clean the other one up.

On my way tomorrow to borrow the leakdown kit , oh and I purchased the Rob Tune ECU :-D
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by CFK »

Great News, The Leakdown went very well. I was told that the previous owner of the car was a mechanic by the kid which i had purchased it off and he used it for 1 "rally", blew a tire right out the gate and shredded the clutch. I had a really good feeling about it when i seen it had a genuine Subaru oil filter and the proper NGK plugs.

Leakdown Results, 91 EJ22T. Tested at 100 PSIG :

Cyl #1: 96 PSIG = 4%
Cyl #2: 96 PSIG = 4%
Cyl #3: 95 PSIG = 5%
Cyl #4: 97 PSIG = 3%

The instructions state that a max 5 PSIG difference between cylinders is allowed. 10-15 require futher investigation. STOKED :!: :-D

So I won't be pulling the motor apart, just doing everything externally without removing heads or cracking the block. I started making a Gasket & seal list :

Rear Main
Oil Separator cover
F&R Cam seals and o-rings
Crank seals
Oil pump o-rings
Oil pan Dipstick tube O-ring
Oil Pick-up o-ring
oil filler neck o-ring
Water Pump housing gasket
Coolant flange gasket ?
Fuel Rail o-rings
Intake Manifold gaskets
throttle body gaskets
IAC gasket
Turbo Gaskets

That's all I can think of ATM, if anyone can ad to that, that would be great. I think by the time I find all those Part #'s and ad them up I wonder if it would be just as easy to order the full Engine Gasket Set
(10105AA052) :?: :smt017

Also, ordered an Exedy WRX OEM Replacement Clutch kit and lightened flywheel. and will be ordering many other things tonight.

:smt035
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by Legacy777 »

Yeah, those are good leak down numbers. Did notice any air slipping out from the intake or crankcase which might indicate slightly worn valves or rings?
Josh

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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by CFK »

No im not really sure where the air was escaping, was just trying to hold the breaker bar on the crank and adjust the gauge to hold a 100 Psig. Would have been nice to have a second person listening I suppose.

The donor car ran stock boost and really looks like it had been torn apart and rebuilt at some point, It could have just had new head gaskets I suppose. There metal and there's a black sealant squished out from the block mating surface. Although I really have no idea what gaskets and sealant the factory did use :?:

Also, it said to do the leakdown with the motor at operating temp, so since it's out of the car and cold. I think those #'s are pretty damn good :!:
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by Legacy777 »

Yeah....you should be good....especially since the motor wasn't at normal operating temp.
Josh

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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by CFK »

Ok, well im still on the fence for popping off the heads and do the head gaskets, it makes sense to just pop em off and do them for piece of mind, at the same time I would like to do Cams after I pass emissions, then again i suppose you can easily do that while in the car. Do the exhaust gaskets as well.

It's just I get a little anal you see, if I pull the heads off i'll probably wanna get then rebuilt and machined, 5 angle valve grind. Then why not throw some Delta regrinds in there. ya know, now that I have the heads off, guess i should just disassemble the block and get it all checked and machined. Hey, now that the blocks apart, obviously I should just order forged internals

ya see what I did there, I just don't know when to stop, one thing leads to another so fast, my Visa snow balls into an Avalanche. So damn indecisive :roll:

OK, so I finally sat down for the last few hours after pressure washing both motors. I went through the entire Engine Parts Manual (104 Pages) and wrote down every seal, gasket and hose I think I will need. Ordered everything from SGP.

I was also wondering if anyone has found that there oil pump was worn out and had to be replaced ?
Or do you just inspect it with a feeler gauge :?:

Also, do the oil pump pick-up's ever crack like later EJ's :?:

Thanks in advance :!:
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by ScottyS »

You'll have to settle on a target power level that your wallet and drivetrain can both deal with, and then do the work appropriate for that.

I had the same questions rattling around and I finally decided that I had to cut it off somewhere. So, I stuck with the stock heads and configuration, and ran the TD04 and 440's. There is always the desire to tinker for more power, and that's what usually happens to people (which is why you rarely see a single car on the road for very long - they either constantly break down or get crashed). Figure out how you want to use the car, set it up accordingly, and be happy (I'm preaching to myself now).

The only thing that I might change would be to use 550's and a VF39-class turbo on the Robtune. But, I already had flow-tested and cleaned 440's and a good TD04, so rather than spend a bunch more money immediately, I figure if I ever get the hankering (or run across good deals) Rob will re-tune the ECU for a nominal fee.

You can figure out pretty fast the cost difference between a simple overhaul and custom internals and machining. It will be more than twice the money, like as not.
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by sqc151 »

^^ exactly the reason im staying sohc. wanna keep it reliable yet have a little fun. (and keep a few bucks in the pocket)

although the shop is fully building my engine w/ forged internals and rebuilding the heads cause im running the rob tune at 18psi, at least i know i wont have to tear it apart anytime soon. the build is costing me a pretty penny, but its only one time i have to use that pretty penny.
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by CFK »

True, I was happy with the TD04. Spools very quickly , just a little more power would have nice. Love the torque of the SOHC's so I will definitely be sticking with those. Not gonna crack the block. Leakdown was solid, pretty sure the motor has been rebuilt. Just undecided whether to pop the heads off and throw some new gaskets in there and do the exhaust ones at the same time. Might as well since I will have everything apart replacing all the seals and hoses. right :?:

I already have the TD05 & 440's cleaned and flowed with new seals and that's why I decided to go one step further and order the Rob Tune. Since I have to pass emissions I'm not able to throw in cams, plus I just found out my tenant is moving out in 2 weeks and my wife wants to quit her job, so I definitely need to be budget conscious !

So I just really wanted to know if most people find there oil pumps are worn after 150k miles and I should just order a new one to be sure there is sufficient pressure , or just test it with a feeler gauge and install an oil pressure Gauge in the Cabin :?:
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by mike-tracy »

I'm not sure about the oil pump at that mileage. I mean, you don't hear about them failing too often but... the pump in my first SS seized, taking the block with it. MPS rebuilds these pumps and tunes them for a little more flow... perhaps you could ask around if speed shops do that up there? Mps's price was quite a bit lower than new iirc.
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by Legacy777 »

I would not recommend pulling the heads to replace the headgasket. The block deck surface will have some indentation in it from the headgasket. So you can do work on the heads, but you end up possibly creating an issue on the block. Unless you are going to machine both surfaces or do something to ensure that the block's deck surface is perfectly smooth, I wouldn't bother pulling the heads.

Regarding the comments on upgrading components. I agree that doing it once is better. If you don't have the funds, save up and do everything at once. Or just stick with what you have and see how it goes. As long as you don't go crazy with the boost, it should be good.

Most of the time the oil pumps are ok. Just check the clearances and make sure the backing plate screws are tight. I usually put a dab of locktite so they don't back out.
Josh

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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by CFK »

That's a great point Josh. Perfect, that's what im gonna do then, leave the heads and exhaust on. Check the Pump with a feeler gauge this time. Last time I checked on the old pump the screws were loose, but never checked clearances :oops:

Will definitely be doing that as well as a Oil Pressure gauge I think since the oil light illuminates at a super low pressure :!:

Im would like 16 PSI on the Rob Tune. How do you like the Cams Josh ? I would like the same thing. Did you send your stock ones to Delta for a Re-Grind ?
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by Legacy777 »

The cams definitely open up the heads and allow for more air & fuel to get in there. I can't really comment fully on how I like them because I don't have the engine tuned fully for this setup. The only downside I'd say for the cams is that it makes your idle a little lopey and not smooth.

Yes I sent my cams to Delta for a re-grind. They may have some that are already done, and you just send them yours as cores. I wanted to keep my cams since I knew they were in good condition...so yeah I just sent them mine to do.
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by CFK »

Well since I have a spare set I will be doing the same thing, just gotta pass those pesky emissions test :smt011

I had a lumpy cam in my Jetta, you would have to keep half your foot on the brake, half on the gas when clutching it at a stop lol ! Alot easier to change out when you on have 1 on top though :!:

Well I ordered the MSD 8239 coil and went to purchase some Aurora 8.5mm plug wires, told them it was a 97 Impreza 2.2. They asked me if it was a U.S. car or not cause they were different ? We called the manufacturer and they said the only difference was that 2 had a 90 and the other set had all 4 straight connections on both ends. Then he said something about a square end that plugs into the valve cover ? I would assume they all have round holes in the covers lol :?:

These Aurora wires are made locally, really good quality and are $60 CDN a set.
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by Legacy777 »

Yeah.....I'm not sure what the difference would be at the valve cover/heads for the plug wires.
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by CFK »

The Aurora wires should work with the MSD 8239 Coilpack, There about 1-1/4" shorter than the stock NGK ones, but they should do : $60 from a local supplier. Aurora 95751 : 95-97 U.S. Model 2.2 Impreza's

http://auroraignitionwires.com/contents ... d1052.html

Wish I knew they come in Black, Cause call me crazy I really don't think the red coilpack, wires, Intake & VC's will go with my green, gold & blue hose colour scheme :-) Might see if I can exchange them for black ones, colour my MSD Black and paint my Intake & VC's GOLD to match my wheels ;-)

Edit : Just called Gary at Aurora Ignition Wires and he said he would make me ones in black 1-1/4" longer to match the NGK ones at no extra cost ! Awesome customer service :!:

I am currently trying to remove my pistons at the moment to see the damage on the old block, pictures later. Also placing my 3rd order to SGP and I will post the full list and total $ once I get everything .

Would I be nuts for ordering all the Timing Cover Gaskets :?: there almost $80 , but I guess you don't want oil seeping in there if something leaks, hence why there all missing or swollen :roll:
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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by Legacy777 »

Order the engine rebuild kit. It has all the gaskets you need.
Josh

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Re: CFK's 92 SS Daily/Project (Updated Apr/17. MOTOR BLOWN,H

Post by CFK »

Alright, 2 months later.......... Motor is back in with many new parts. Pictures later. I installed the Exedy Lightened Flywheel / OEM WRX Clutch combo kit.

All of a sudden the clutch pedal stays to the floor, studied all the manuals and Diagrams when installing it and swear I had everything in the correct place / direction. Spring attached from fork to sensors bracket. Fluid in reservoir ( Dirty, will flush and bleed )

WHY :?: OH :!: WHY :?:
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