1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CEL?

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none77
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1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CEL?

Post by none77 » Sun Jun 22, 2014 3:32 pm

I need some suggestions about getting my 1991 legacy wagon 122,000 Miles,
running properly. Last Sunday I was driving the car, and CEL came on.
Car started running very rough. I knew it was a bad Fuel injector. I had
a couple of bad injectors over the last year, and I had used a few I
got from junkyard.



I was surprised to find the price of bostech injectors
had gone down. I ordered 4 new injectors and replaced them all with new
injectors. The car was very difficult to star, after changing
injectors, and I realized it was flooded. I got it started, but it was
running rough, and smoked a lot.



I checked plugs and they were fouled. I replaced plugs,
but it's still running very rough. It runs just fine in my neighborhood,
at slow speeds when I'm getting on highway, If I step on the gas, it
just seems to bog down, and not accelerate. If I very gently press the
gas, it will gradually get up to speed, but doesn't seem to shift at
correct times. It was running great last week before these problems
started.



The lack of CEL leaves me guessing. I started to wonder if the fuel injectors I purchased are teh problem?



I did notice the new injectors had a round O ring on bottom, and I think the stock In jectors have a flat rubber gasket?



I'm open to any suggestions.



Lou

none77
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Re: 1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CE

Post by none77 » Sun Jun 22, 2014 3:35 pm

Is there anything special I should have done after replacing all 4 injectors? Like reset computer, or drive car for 100 miles? In the past I just swapped the injector, and I was back in business.

I should note the new injectors had different "Round Style" O rings on the bottom, and the injectors I removed had the flat orange gasket. I'm wondering if this could be problem.

none77
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Re: 1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CE

Post by none77 » Sun Jun 22, 2014 8:17 pm

I removed the injectors and put the flat orange spacer on under the bottom O Ring.

Car seems to run better, but still not normal.

James614
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Re: 1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CE

Post by James614 » Sun Jun 22, 2014 9:12 pm

As long as the o rings dont leak under pressure, the style is irrelevant. If they did leak out you'd find out very quickly when trying to start your car. Are you absolutely certain you were given the proper injectors for auto/manual and turbo/non-turbo? Theres 3 different styles for the 91 Legacy. Assuming nothing else went wrong when you changed injectors, a mixup in the application seems most likely.
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none77
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Re: 1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CE

Post by none77 » Mon Jun 23, 2014 12:23 am

The Injectors have the proper model on the box, and look correct. Grey Tops, connector on side?

I am at a complete loss. It seems like its running to rich. I wonder if pressure regulator could be going?

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Re: 1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CE

Post by James614 » Mon Jun 23, 2014 1:17 am

You could use a fuel pressure test kit to see if its getting the right pressure. The kit would tie into the supply line coming off the fuel filter. Most parts stores rent them for free.

Did you ensure the vacuum line on the pressure regulator didnt become disconnected?
93 Touring Wagon (EJ20G 5spd Swap) -- Finally back and running strong as ever!

05 Outback 2.5XT 5spd -- Now the wife can have her SUV and get in on the turbo Legacy goodness at the same time.

Legacy777
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Re: 1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CE

Post by Legacy777 » Mon Jun 23, 2014 1:56 am

Did you ever check the ECU for codes before putting new injectors in? If not, trust me on this as I speak from experience....you ALWAYS want to do that first before doing anything. Probably 14 years ago I was having issues with the car....it was acting up...and I "knew" it was something with the fuel system/injector...so I went out and bought a bunch of stuff to clean it. That wasn't the problem, the MAF sensor was the problem. Had I checked the codes first I would have save myself a lot of headache and money.

Personally, I would recommend putting the old injectors back in and see how the engine runs? If you never reset the ECU, pull the stored code and see what it is. The instructions are on my site.
Josh

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1990 Legacy (AWD, 6MT, & EJ22T Swap)
1997 Impreza OBS

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none77
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Re: 1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CE

Post by none77 » Mon Jun 23, 2014 5:01 am

I had not checked the ECU code prior to replacing injectors. I had a couple 3 replacement injectors (Black), and one original Grey. I had a good friend who was a Subaru Master Tech, but he passed away last November. I had pulled the Black Injectors from Junk yard, and Tim (My friend) said they would work just fine.

When I started looking for replacement connectors, I learned the Grey Tops are for Auto Trans which my car has, and I had been driving around for a few months with 3 black injectors. I thought I should replace them all.

I never did reset the ECU, but I did have battery disconnected for extended period. I think the ECU might erase the codes after being disconnected from battery for several hours???

Thanks for all the help. I will get fuel pressure tester tomorrow, and test pressure later this week.

none77
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Re: 1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CE

Post by none77 » Mon Jun 23, 2014 5:41 pm

I checked ECU Codes. With Black connectors... I didn't get any codes. When I connected Green Connectors, and drove car following Instructions from site. I got 32 which is O2 Sensor.

I'm not sure why I wouldn't get a normal CEL light, but I will order a O2 sensor, and give it a try.

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Re: 1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CE

Post by Legacy777 » Mon Jun 23, 2014 5:43 pm

Yes, disconnecting the battery for extended periods of time typically will erase the codes.

I guess the thing I question is what fuel rails are installed. the rails are different between the "grey" & "black" injectors. So if the rails are meant for the black injectors and the grey injectors are not seating properly they could be causing an over rich situation. Are there any markings/part #'s on the rails?
Josh

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1990 Legacy (AWD, 6MT, & EJ22T Swap)
1997 Impreza OBS

If you need to get a hold of me please email me rather then pm

none77
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Re: 1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CE

Post by none77 » Tue Jun 24, 2014 12:31 am

The rails are the original rails for the stock Grey Injectors. My Dad was a mechanic, and purchased this car new in 1991. It was 100% stock when I inherited it in 2001. The few times it needed repairs, he used Subaru OEM Parts.

The very first time, I had injector problems I was on my way to work, and barely made it. My Friend Tim (Subaru Tech) came to my work, and replaced the injector with a black top that I pulled from junkyard. He said "It will be fine." I trusted he would know, because he was a Subaru Tech for 15 years. He unexpectedly passed away in November. The car seemed to run reliable with 2 black, and two grey injectors. but gas mileage was bad.

I had pulled a bunch of spare parts in 2012. I realized I was seeing fewer of these cars in the junkyard, and it took me a year to find a good salvage transmission. I have spare coils, and lots of parts for door locks, but I haven't been successful at repairing the door locking itself, and key sticking problems. I have tried several times to fix locks.

I noticed the instructions in FSM say to completely remove the Fuel rail when replacing injectors.

I just discovered that the hose from pressure regulator can be disconnected to prevent fuel from seeping into cylinder when changing injectors. Learning new things is the fun part of fixing cars.

Thanks for all the help. I'm hoping I'm getting closer to solving problem.

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Re: 1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CE

Post by Legacy777 » Wed Jun 25, 2014 5:24 pm

none77 wrote:I just discovered that the hose from pressure regulator can be disconnected to prevent fuel from seeping into cylinder when changing injectors. Learning new things is the fun part of fixing cars.

Can you elaborate what you mean by your statement above? Are you talking about the small vacuum line going to the fuel pressure regulator? That should have no affect on things when the engine is turned off.
Josh

surrealmirage.com/subaru
1990 Legacy (AWD, 6MT, & EJ22T Swap)
1997 Impreza OBS

If you need to get a hold of me please email me rather then pm

none77
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Re: 1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CE

Post by none77 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 3:16 pm

I haven't tried it yet, but when I was searching for information on fuel injectors.

I saw a reference that you can disconnect fuel line going to Injector from Fuel Pressure Regulator, and blow through hose to evacuate fuel from fuel rails. This would prevent fuel sweeping into cyclinder while injectors are removed.

When I replaced the injectors the first time, car was hard to start because it seemed flooded, from some gas that leaked into cylinder when I had injector out.

The second time, I removed the plugs and turned engine over by hand to purge fuel from cylinders before starting.

My procedure for replacing the injectors was primarily based on watching my friend who was a Subaru tech do it similar way. I was surprised because the FSM recommends removing all parts of intake, until you can remove the fuel rails. replacing injectors in Fuel rails off car, and then re-assemble the intake.

I should receive my O2 Sensor in the mail today. I sprayed old one down with PB Blaster last night. I'm going to try and remove it from the top side.

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Re: 1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CE

Post by none77 » Sun Jun 29, 2014 7:56 am

Problem Solved! Fuel Injector Problems. Bosetech Injectors, they look correct with grey tops, but don't work properly.

I checked Fuel Pressure, Vacuum. Replaced O2 and Maf Sensor. The Y connector on my PCV Valve Hose broke when I was removing hose. I went to junyard and was lucky enough to find 2 black Fluel injectors. I'm running car with 3 Black and One Grey injector, and its running Normal.

I need to find 4 grey top fuel injectors for Auto Transmission, Non Turbo.

Huge thanks to everyone for trouble shooting help!!

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Re: 1991 Legacy Running Terrible after new Injectors - No CE

Post by Legacy777 » Mon Jul 07, 2014 7:39 pm

Good deal. Yeah, it should run better with all the proper plugs
Josh

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1990 Legacy (AWD, 6MT, & EJ22T Swap)
1997 Impreza OBS

If you need to get a hold of me please email me rather then pm

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