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 Post subject: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2016 12:25 am 
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Greetings from CO. I'm a new member. I want to add the EJ22T turbo to an EJ22E NA longblock, and need info on the specific header, exhaust, subframe, coolant/oil line modifications, and ECU needed. Is there an FAQ or basic outline for doing this modification? I have been looking everywhere, all I find are people swapping their EJ20Gs or EJ22T longblocks into their Legacies.

Thanks to everyone, and glad to be a new member of the community.


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2016 5:38 pm 
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Welcome to the BBS.

Is there a reason you're not wanting to swap in the turbo motor? It's really a more completed job to try and add a turbo to a non-turbo motor since everything is custom and retrofitted to work. Plus with the higher compression you'll not be able to run much boost. Have you considered how you are going to handle the engine management? At a minimum you'll need something to add fuel and pull timing under boost. I had a friend that went down this route and while the car made power it just never really performed at it's best because everything was pieced together.

I'd really suggest you look into swapping in a completed turbo engine with the appropriate sensors, engine management, etc. It may sound like more money, but in the long run it may net out to the same and save you a lot of headaches.

If you can provide us a little more information about your goals that would help in providing additional feedback.

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1990 Legacy (AWD, 6MT, & EJ22T Swap)
1997 Impreza OBS

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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2016 10:30 pm 
Fifth Gear
Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:17 am
Posts: 6214
Location: Lakewood, Wa 98439
I'm going to also agree with Josh. You would have much less of a headache swapping in a whole turbo legacy engine.

You'll want to find a turbo legacy sub frame. You can use a wrx or sti frame as well. Exhaust is easy but you need to know what you're buying.

If you find a down pipe to axle back from a turbo legacy, there wont be any modifications necessary. If you choose to go with something from newer model Subaru you will have some modifications necessary to make it work, like extending some piping.

Any stock turbo header and uppipe will work for you, newer stuff will probably have an egt port you will want to close up or use for an egt gauge.

There might be some info on sl-i.net for turboing the 22E that you can reference, or even reach out to Facebook. there's a lot of Subaru groups with knowledgeable people that would be willing to help out.

If you are interested in some stock turbo parts, pm me. I have some stuff i wouldn't mind selling for a reasonable price.

_________________
91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 2:06 am 
Fifth Gear
Joined: Fri May 04, 2007 4:09 pm
Posts: 2235
Location: N. ID
I agree w/the above, but since I've done both, see what I and others have done. Note that these may show a '95+ a car but they are nearly identical to the '90-'94 2.2.

Look here:
Link1
Link2
Link3 - to do it the 'right way'

_________________
Turbo Subies:
'87 GL-10 Turbo 4WD Wagon (pre-Loyale) - SOLD
'90 BJ, EJ22T/DOHC and 5-speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX GG-SOLD
'96 BD - turbo'd-SOLD


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 2:17 am 
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Posts: 37
Thank you both so much for the info. I want to save some money by building my vehicle's engine and using it for donor parts, rather than purchasing a full engine. Stock crank, stock rods, forged dish pistons for 8.5:1 ratio, turbo cams, stock head and valvetrain, stock harness with EJ22T ECU ( with minor mods), fabricated oil/coolant lines, everything else bolt-on. I don't know if I need a special crossmember for the exhaust.

@Josh my goal is very mild, 7-9 PSi boost. Just enough for some everyday punch, nothing more. Right now I have a Volvo 940 factory turbo, but it's a sedan and I need the AWD wagon for winter weather and hauling gear.

I want to keep the 940 as my primary driver while I have the Legacy in the garage and work on it for an extended period of time.


Last edited by janas19 on Sat Oct 08, 2016 5:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 5:44 am 
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What about this configuration:

EJ22E bottom end
Low compression pistons
EJ22T heads
EJ22T ECU
VF11 Turbo

Seems like that could be cheap and effective. What do you guys think?


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 6:40 am 
Fifth Gear
Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:17 am
Posts: 6214
Location: Lakewood, Wa 98439
I think that would work great. I haven't tried that myself. I have tried the ej20 with stock 22t heads, that was a fun little engine.

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

_________________
91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 9:16 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 06, 2016 10:25 pm
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I have two goals: long-term reliability and low cost. I want it to be bullet-proof and run for 100K miles. I also want to spend as little as possible. Some people might say you can't have both reliable and cheap. I think it's possible to do over a longer period of time, if most of the work is done myself.

The plan is to acquire a high mileage (250K+) 94-95 Legacy wagon. Pull the engine and rebuild the bottom end. I think stock crank and stock rods are enough for 7-8 PSi tbh. Get forged low compression pistons. All new OEM bearings and bolts, cylinders honed, new oil pump, block machined, etc. Might take the rods and crank to a real tuner and get them balanced and blueprinted, maybe. I'd love to do that but not sure how it fits in the budget.

While that's happening, I'll look for EJ22T heads. Maybe I'll get lucky and find ones that are in good shape and don't need much work. GD on UltimateSubaru says:

Quote:
"SOHC heads fit better into a lot of the older chassis (EA81's for example can't run the DOHC), and they are MUCH easier to service - plugs, valve adjustment, valve cover gaskets, etc. All around a more pleasant experience. a rebuild on the DOHC heads runs $500 compared to about $175 on the SOHC heads."


Low cost, easy to maintain SOHC? Sounds pretty good, the goal isn't a boost monster but everyday driving. With the turbo cams on top and rebuilt bottom end, I think it's ready for the VF11 and stock ECU.

That's the main gist, am I doing it right?


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 9:26 am 
Fifth Gear
Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:17 am
Posts: 6214
Location: Lakewood, Wa 98439
I have a set of 22t heads for sale if you are interested.

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

_________________
91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 3:36 pm 
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Condition? Price?

I may buy them.


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 3:41 pm 
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Joined: Fri May 04, 2007 4:09 pm
Posts: 2235
Location: N. ID
For only 7-8psi you don't need to 'build' a bottom end, IMHO. The '90-'96 EJ22e ('96 had different valvetrain and single-port exhaust but same internals) is a strong engine, and you'll find LOTS of others boosting it way more, w/the necessary EM to keep it alive. There are posts on here from 'Reddevil' making over 200HP/torque. The EJ22E reportedly has the same forged crank and rods as the EJ22T.

On my '96 Legacy L (stock EJ22e and 4EAT) I've put approx. 3K miles on my '91 EJ22e w/EJ22T heads, running WG boost of 5-6psi on the VF11. My CR is around ~9.5:1. I run stock plug gap and stock injectors.

My upgrades include an STi fuel pump, EJ25D ECU (it may supply more fuel), TBE - 3" DP + WRX mid-pipe and muffler. And I run 92 from Costco (Top Tier).

My phone App shows a 0-60 of 7.9 seconds, which is NOT quick, but @ least a second faster than stock (and on 2" taller tires-mines lifted on OB struts). Probably an extra 40 HP/ft-lbs.

I get you want to build a reliable, 100K mile engine, but I think Subaru already did. :-)

My only Neg is my MPG is about the same as an SS - 19/24- IIRC.

P.s. My engine came out of a local PullnSave and the guy I bought it from didn't know the miles. Burns 1/2 Qt between 3K mile OCI's.

TD

_________________
Turbo Subies:
'87 GL-10 Turbo 4WD Wagon (pre-Loyale) - SOLD
'90 BJ, EJ22T/DOHC and 5-speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX GG-SOLD
'96 BD - turbo'd-SOLD


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 4:01 pm 
Fifth Gear
Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:17 am
Posts: 6214
Location: Lakewood, Wa 98439
200k ish and I drove the car home. Crank shaft was broken at the pulley, that's why I parted out the motor.

I think the last price I listed them for was just under a hundred bucks.

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

_________________
91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 4:35 pm 
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wtdash wrote:
w/the necessary EM to keep it alive.


What you consider to be good em for a build like this, that keeps costs down.

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1992 Legacy SS 5mt, reasonably modified ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 5:42 pm 
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Posts: 37
Wtdash, how are you running the EJ25D ECU on EJ22T heads? That requires custom wiring?

Also I think rebuilding the engine makes sense in my situation. Legacies in good shape under 200K go for around $1500 here, so if I can drive to Denver and get one with engine issues for $500, then why not build a new engine for the same price? I'm pulling the engine already for heads and HG.

Also you're running 92 fuel and have a Walbro pump. I'd like to run 87 if possible, using the OEM 22T injectors and OEM ECU. Efficiency is important to me and my goal is to use factory EM as much as possible.

Hope what I'm saying makes some sense


Last edited by janas19 on Sat Oct 08, 2016 5:50 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 5:44 pm 
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Cj91, $100 sounds reasonable. Only issue is shipping cost. Unless you know someone at UPS, think I'm going to search for sth in CO. Also need a bevy of other parts too. Thanks for offering.


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 5:52 pm 
Fifth Gear
Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:17 am
Posts: 6214
Location: Lakewood, Wa 98439
Usps would be the best route and I can package them up nice and safe. Pm me if you wanna work out a deal and I can get a quote.

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

_________________
91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 5:54 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 9:09 pm
Posts: 1204
Location: Rochester, WA
You won't be able to run 87 octane fuel on any factory ECU with a turbo, regardless of if you use a 22t ECU or any factory N/A ECU. You'd need some sort of fully programmable aftermarket ECU, and power output will be significantly lower than running 91+ octane.

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2005 Legacy GT Limited Wagon 5-Speed. Stock-ish ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 6:46 pm 
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I'm running 87 pump fuel on my current vehicle that's a Volvo 940 Turbo. It has a large front intercooler but all stock AFAIK. Any reason why it wouldn't work?


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 6:49 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:17 am
Posts: 6214
Location: Lakewood, Wa 98439
To be honest, any vehicle that is setup for turbo, whether factory or not, should run premium fuel.

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

_________________
91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 6:51 pm 
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janas19 wrote:
I'm running 87 pump fuel on my current vehicle that's a Volvo 940 Turbo. It has a large front intercooler but all stock AFAIK. Any reason why it wouldn't work?



I believe your Volvo is tuned to run on both regular and premium, the older turbo european cars usually were. You give up power and fuel economy to run regular on that ECU, however. What is the difference in fill-up cost between premium and regular? For my Legacy it is about 2 energy drinks and a small bag of peanuts.

cj91legss wrote:
To be honest, any vehicle that is setup for turbo, whether factory or not, should run premium fuel.

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk


The 80s Subarus with the ea81t engines were designed to run on regular. They only made 115hp though ;) The early 80s SVO turbo mustangs had a switch on the dash to select regular or premium fuel, whereas cars with better fuel computers did that automatically somehow.

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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 7:11 pm 
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So if I run premium in the Volvo, I should get more power? Also wondering if it's possible to run 87 in a EJ22 Turbo with stock boost, or is there going to be detonation?


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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 7:16 pm 
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janas19 wrote:
So if I run premium in the Volvo, I should get more power? Also wondering if it's possible to run 87 in a EJ22 Turbo with stock boost, or is there going to be detonation?


Your Volvo will get both more power and fuel economy on premium. The Legacy turbo ecu is tuned exclusively for 91-93 octane and will start melting internal parts on 87-89. How long it'll take is anyone's guess. But the engines are 22 years old at the newest, so I wouldn't give it long. It would be even worse if you used a non-turbo block, due to higher compression.

As alphuis said, you can spend a couple grand on engine management and tune to run it on regular, at the cost of power and fuel economy. Subaru didn't spend thousands of hours testing and tuning their setup on regular fuel, unlike Volvo, Saab, etc.

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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 7:19 pm 
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You know what, the ej25 engines make slightly more HP, and slightly less torque than a bone stock ej22t, all on regular. Perhaps that is more what you are looking for. You'll have to do a bit of rewiring with any engine you put in, but that's my vote.

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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 7:30 pm 
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Joined: Fri May 04, 2007 4:09 pm
Posts: 2235
Location: N. ID
janas19 wrote:
Wtdash, how are you running the EJ25D ECU on EJ22T heads? That requires custom wiring?



No...The '96-'98 Legacy, Impreza and Forester all share the same wiring and harness type - both 2.2 and 2.5 (I don't know about the '96+ EJ18), and they're all OBD2. It was literally plug-n-play. I'm using my stock '96 IM and wiring harness, too. The SOHC IM is interchangeable from '90-'98....there are wiring differences and TPS is different, but you can put a '90-'94 harness on a '95-'98 engine and vice versa. EGR is the main difference on the OBD2 cars but there's a workaround for that.

(Tangent: The '95 Legacy and Impreza EJ22e + 4EAT were also OBD2, but I've read their ECU may not play as well w/ '96-'98 cars.)

The EJ25D had the DOHC heads and made and extra 30 HP/Torque, so I'm assuming that means it pulled in more air and fuel. As my turbo pulls in more air (as far as the MAF is concerned), I'm hoping it makes use of it, too. The Ej25D uses the sames 280cc (?) injectors as the 2.2, so the ECU tune does SOMEthing. I also plugged my LC-1 wideband in to check AFR's and never got more lean than 12:1, which although on the edge, I've read lots of online posts of cars making a lot more POWer than me, running as high as 11.5:1.

Quote:
Also I think rebuilding the engine makes sense in my situation. Legacies in good shape under 200K go for around $1500 here, so if I can drive to Denver and get one with engine issues for $500, then why not build a new engine for the same price? I'm pulling the engine already for heads and HG.



Yeah...your source for EJ22's really does determine the Project co$t. Here in the NW, Subies hold there value even after they've seen their best days...years ago. :-(

Quote:

Also you're running 92 fuel and have a Walbro pump. I'd like to run 87 if possible, using the OEM 22T injectors and OEM ECU. Efficiency is important to me and my goal is to use factory EM as much as possible.

Hope what I'm saying makes some sense


Please keep searching/ reading, as the stock EJ22T ECU requires Premium / 91 Octane. From Cars101.com:
Quote:
2.2L turbo charged 4 cylinder Boxer engine
HP 160@5600rpm, torque 181@2800rpm
..... Premium fuel 91 Octane ....



And Have Fun! :-)

_________________
Turbo Subies:
'87 GL-10 Turbo 4WD Wagon (pre-Loyale) - SOLD
'90 BJ, EJ22T/DOHC and 5-speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX GG-SOLD
'96 BD - turbo'd-SOLD


Last edited by wtdash on Sat Oct 08, 2016 7:34 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 7:32 pm 
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Posts: 37
I actually was thinking along the same lines. But after doing some reading on frankenmotors, seems putting a smaller, better flowing head on the EJ25 raises the compression and requires premium fuel anyway! Also the EJ25 is notorious for head gasket failures, even if you use the MLG it can still fail. Which leads me right back to the 22T.

I still got a lot to think about since I only want to break the engine down once and do it right the FIRST time.


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