Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Heads, valves, pistons, rods, crankshaft, etc...

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cj91legss
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by cj91legss »

Yes the 25 is notorious for gasket failure. The 22 is a little more generous in that area. Fortunately the 22 uses a composite gasket which is much more forgiving. MLS gaskets are nice. You just need to have heads resurfaced at the bare minimum.

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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by wtdash »

mike-tracy wrote:You know what, the ej25 engines make slightly more HP, and slightly less torque than a bone stock ej22t, all on regular. Perhaps that is more what you are looking for. You'll have to do a bit of rewiring with any engine you put in, but that's my vote.
yes....if you do the HG w/the new/est gasket you'll get another 100K of it AS LONG AS THE BOTTOM END HASN"T BEEN OVERHEATED....if it has you're on borrowed time...and rod bearings.

And I believe the torque is better from idle?
Turbo Subies:
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by mike-tracy »

I actually think the research and planning stage is as much fun as the building part. :)
1992 Legacy SS 5mt, build in progress
Josh Colombo wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2002 10:23 am Wait....I'm confused now.
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by cj91legss »

mike-tracy wrote:I actually think the research and planning stage is as much fun as the building part. :)
I disagree. I'm still wrecking my brain on my engine. I'd rather just build and go lol.

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92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by cj91legss »

I'm very impatient though....

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91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
janas19
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by janas19 »

wtdash wrote:
No...The '96-'98 Legacy, Impreza and Forester all share the same wiring and harness type - both 2.2 and 2.5 (I don't know about the '96+ EJ18), and they're all OBD2. It was literally plug-n-play. I'm using my stock '96 IM and wiring harness, too.
Oh wow I'm stupid. Yeah, because it's in the 1st gen body and harness.... Gosh, I should check what forum I'm in before posting! :oops:

Edit: Wiring harness from the 96 on the 22T heads, that has to be some modification? 96 is OBDII, 22T is OBDI? :|

I don't know, I've been reading Wikipedia articles for the last 4 hours, my brain is fried man
Last edited by janas19 on Sat Oct 08, 2016 7:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
mike-tracy
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by mike-tracy »

wtdash wrote:
mike-tracy wrote:You know what, the ej25 engines make slightly more HP, and slightly less torque than a bone stock ej22t, all on regular. Perhaps that is more what you are looking for. You'll have to do a bit of rewiring with any engine you put in, but that's my vote.
yes....if you do the HG w/the new/est gasket you'll get another 100K of it AS LONG AS THE BOTTOM END HASN"T BEEN OVERHEATED....if it has you're on borrowed time...and rod bearings.

And I believe the torque is better from idle?
I haven't seen stock for stock dyno plots. But I have owned multiple ej22t's and ej25d's, and a sohc ej253. The 25d makes power (torque?) noticeably later than the ej253 and 22t. The sohc ej25s are better for a daily driver imo, whereas the ej25d's are an engine that loves to rev, and are fun in a light car like the original 1998 RS. My 2000 RS had the ej25 sohc, and had nothing up top.
1992 Legacy SS 5mt, build in progress
Josh Colombo wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2002 10:23 am Wait....I'm confused now.
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by wtdash »

mike-tracy wrote:
wtdash wrote: w/the necessary EM to keep it alive.
What you consider to be good em for a build like this, that keeps costs down.
Mike - I'm assuming you mean on the '96-'98 stuff??, since we're both WELL versed in the Rob Tune, ESL and long gone Revtronix avl. to the 1st Gen. :-)

Piggy-backs and standalones are about it. I used a Greddy Emanage Ultimate on my '98 Forester project, and although it ran, I never got it 'right'. Since there are no USA turbo models from '95-'02, AND we moved to OBDII b4 anyone else we don't have the luxury of swapping in an EJ20G ECU from the same WRX/STI/Forester Turbo mid-90's models from overseas....w/out major harness swapping. If you're going to go to that trouble, just go '02+ WRX for the Open Source/COBB tuning options.

But if you want to just run boost on the stock EJ22e (or EJ25D) ECU from '90-'98, the basic recipe is what I'm doing PLUS an RRFPR and TMIC. 10 PSI all day, is doable.
Last edited by wtdash on Sat Oct 08, 2016 7:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Turbo Subies:
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T
janas19
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by janas19 »

Mike-tracy, good to know. So far you guys have been a treasure pool of info for a noob like me.
wtdash
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by wtdash »

mike-tracy wrote: The sohc ej25s are better for a daily driver imo, whereas the ej25d's are an engine that loves to rev, and are fun in a light car like the original 1998 RS. My 2000 RS had the ej25 sohc, and had nothing up top.
Yeah...this makes sense, after 'reflection', as those '99+ SOHC EJ25 heads are supposedly much better than any previous iteration.
Turbo Subies:
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T
cj91legss
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by cj91legss »

Just know that this isn't going to be the end. You say a hundred k motor. In a year or so you're going to want more....

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk
91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
wtdash
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by wtdash »

cj91legss wrote:Just know that this isn't going to be the end. You say a hundred k motor. In a year or so you're going to want more....

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

BTW, to the OP: What YEAR and Trans do you have now? Unless I missed, it?
Last edited by wtdash on Sat Oct 08, 2016 7:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Turbo Subies:
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T
mike-tracy
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by mike-tracy »

wtdash wrote:
mike-tracy wrote:
wtdash wrote: w/the necessary EM to keep it alive.
What you consider to be good em for a build like this, that keeps costs down.
Mike - I'm assuming you mean on the '96-'98 stuff??, since we're both WELL versed in the Rob Tune, ESL and long gone Revtronix avl. to the 1st Gen. :-)

Piggy-backs and standalones are about it. I used a Greddy Emanage Ultimate on my '98 Forester project, and although it ran, I never got it 'right'. Since there are no USA turbo models from '95-'02, AND we moved to OBDII b4 anyone else we don't have the luxury of swapping in an EJ20G ECU from the same WRX/STI/Forester Turbo mid-90's models from overseas....w/out major harness swapping. If you're going to go to that trouble, just go '02+ WRX for the Open Source/COBB tuning options.

But if you want to just run boost on the stock EJ22e (or EJ25D) ECU from '90-'98, the basic recipe is what I'm doing PLUS an RRFPR and TMIC. 10 PSI all day, is doable.

Yes Todd, I'm not very familiar with turboing the 2nd (or later) gens. I had assumed good EM (not a half-way solution that may or may not work right like a piggy back) meant a wire in standalone or USDM wrx harness merge. I was just hoping you had found a plug in solution like the ESL.
1992 Legacy SS 5mt, build in progress
Josh Colombo wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2002 10:23 am Wait....I'm confused now.
cj91legss
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by cj91legss »

??

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92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by wtdash »

Edit: Wiring harness from the 96 on the 22T heads, that has to be some modification? 96 is OBDII, 22T is OBDI? :|

No, EXCEPT for the EJ22T IAC valve*...remember, the SOHC IM works on '90-'98 EJ22e engines, and the harness works w/the matching TPS - everything else plugs in. The heads have the water and oil lines source/feed, but otherwise they're the same as the '90-'95 heads.

*The IAC from an EJ22T has a 90° elbow to clear the turbo. I'd start looking for one now, as they're getting scarce. The NA version works but it's a really tight fit.
Last edited by wtdash on Sat Oct 08, 2016 8:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Turbo Subies:
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T
janas19
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by janas19 »

wtdash wrote:
cj91legss wrote:Just know that this isn't going to be the end. You say a hundred k motor. In a year or so you're going to want more....

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

BTW, to the OP: What YEAR and Trans do you have now? Unless I missed, it?
Zero :mrgreen:

I just have the 940 atm, I'm doing my research now so I can narrow down the exact model year/chassis to purchase.
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by mike-tracy »

wtdash wrote:
mike-tracy wrote: The sohc ej25s are better for a daily driver imo, whereas the ej25d's are an engine that loves to rev, and are fun in a light car like the original 1998 RS. My 2000 RS had the ej25 sohc, and had nothing up top.
Yeah...this makes sense, after 'reflection', as those '99+ SOHC EJ25 heads are supposedly much better than any previous iteration.
They probably do flow better, but don't have easily drill and tap points for oil and coolant like the phase I dohc heads. The cams and tuning is setup for immediate torque, so they are great drivers. But having owned ej25d's in manual cars, I missed the power up top. Supposedly the AVCS (variable valve timing for the uninitiated) based SOHC ej25's have power all over.
1992 Legacy SS 5mt, build in progress
Josh Colombo wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2002 10:23 am Wait....I'm confused now.
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by mike-tracy »

janas19 wrote:
wtdash wrote:
cj91legss wrote:Just know that this isn't going to be the end. You say a hundred k motor. In a year or so you're going to want more....

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

BTW, to the OP: What YEAR and Trans do you have now? Unless I missed, it?
Zero :mrgreen:

I just have the 940 atm, I'm doing my research now so I can narrow down the exact model year/chassis to purchase.
If you don't have a car yet, and don't plan to run a stock ej22t, I'd like to encourage you to get a 2nd or 3rd gen legacy. They have more parts available at this stage, (arguably) better interiors, better driving dynamics when setup for it (mostly due to stiffer chassis) etc.

Since it's not your primary car, you could take your time on the build, sourcing better parts for good deals. To keep it emissions legal, and very upgradeable/capable, you could swap in the electronics from a USDM 2002-2005 WRX, and have a fully tunable/obd-ii compatible car that is a tune away from adding basically any go-fast part you could think of.
1992 Legacy SS 5mt, build in progress
Josh Colombo wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2002 10:23 am Wait....I'm confused now.
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by wtdash »

Janas19: If you have the option, I believe the '92-'94 had fewer gotchas than the '90-'91. The '90-'91 w/the 5-speed / manual trans had some weird wiring @ the TPS and/or IAC that could requires some work on the harness to the ECU. As well as a different ECU (although still 4 plug, I believe).

But my '90 EJ22e w/the stock 4EAT/Automatic had no problems running both the EJ22T and EJ20G ECU's (w/the mods to match the ECU's requirements) w/all the stuff I did to it. :-)
Turbo Subies:
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T
cj91legss
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by cj91legss »

I went that route a couple years ago, I think my knuckles still hurt...

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91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
wtdash
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by wtdash »

mike-tracy wrote: If you don't have a car yet, and don't plan to run a stock ej22t, I'd like to encourage you to get a 2nd or 3rd gen legacy. They have more parts available at this stage, (arguably) better interiors, better driving dynamics when setup for it (mostly due to stiffer chassis) etc.

Since it's not your primary car, you could take your time on the build, sourcing better parts for good deals. To keep it emissions legal, and very upgradeable/capable, you could swap in the electronics from a USDM 2002-2005 WRX, and have a fully tunable/obd-ii compatible car that is a tune away from adding basically any go-fast part you could think of.
+100

And no motorized seat belts! (Although I have an App, er Mod, for that!).
Turbo Subies:
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T
cj91legss
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by cj91legss »

wtdash wrote:
mike-tracy wrote: If you don't have a car yet, and don't plan to run a stock ej22t, I'd like to encourage you to get a 2nd or 3rd gen legacy. They have more parts available at this stage, (arguably) better interiors, better driving dynamics when setup for it (mostly due to stiffer chassis) etc.

Since it's not your primary car, you could take your time on the build, sourcing better parts for good deals. To keep it emissions legal, and very upgradeable/capable, you could swap in the electronics from a USDM 2002-2005 WRX, and have a fully tunable/obd-ii compatible car that is a tune away from adding basically any go-fast part you could think of.
+100

And no motorized seat belts! (Although I have an App, er Mod, for that!).
I kinda miss my electric seatbelts... :-(

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk
91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
janas19
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by janas19 »

Please don't exile me, but I wanted a second or third gen originally. For pretty much the reasons you said.

However - I was thinking 1st gen with the 22T heads would be super easy in terms of wiring. Just change a few pins around and add one sensor I think.

Maybe I could get a later gen with the WRX parts, and rewire. Realistic chances of success for someone on a first time swap?
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by cj91legss »

janas19 wrote:Please don't exile me, but I wanted a second or third gen originally. For pretty much the reasons you said.

However - I was thinking 1st gen with the 22T heads would be super easy in terms of wiring. Just change a few pins around and add one sensor I think.

Maybe I could get a later gen with the WRX parts, and rewire. Realistic chances of success for someone on a first time swap?
Realistic chances.... if you set your mind to it you can do it.

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk
91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
janas19
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Re: Turbocharging the EJ22E?

Post by janas19 »

cj91legss wrote: Realistic chances.... if you set your mind to it you can do it.
I like to have all my ducks in order before I start any project. And it seems like there's a lot more to understand about the WRX swap than there is the 22T swap. The OBDII ECU isn't my strong point and that information is a bit intimidating to me.
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