Tuning the stock turbo legacy ECU

tris91ricer · Post by **tris91ricer** » Mon May 01, 2006 7:40 am

Nico, you're not actually retarded or disabled in some way, are you?
I suppose some learning disorders could be categorized in that as well, if you'd like to share. I'd rather you not be our token moron, I'm sure you're kinda cool. Want a helping hand?

555BCTurbo · Post by **555BCTurbo** » Mon May 01, 2006 8:22 am

How exactly do you know your HP rating without dynoing the car Nico??

Color me stupid, but I think there is something missing

NICO · Post by **NICO** » Tue May 02, 2006 1:22 am

i was on the dyno, we did a dyno tune and a street tune.

OK here is MY HUGE PROBLEM ITS KILLING ME, boost cut fuel cut what ever is stopping me to make power i what to MURDER IT.

i have made a vrg3 fcd i have a turbo smart fcd manual eltronic hks fcd none of them work i cant stop this DAME CUT. please any one have a simple idea that could help me.

i am not retartd guys come on.

Splinter · Post by **Splinter** » Tue May 02, 2006 2:00 am

Are you sure its fuel cut, not starvation?

What upgrades have you done to the stock fuel system?

NICO · Post by **NICO** » Tue May 02, 2006 3:00 am

^^ i have a huge fuel pump sti 550cc injectors, paul the tuner siad i am good for fuel no lean spots.

could timeing be wrong?

when i drive the car at 10psi its fine no boost cut at all, when i crank the boost to 17psi i hit boost cut at 4000rpm then it stats back up and agian at 5000rpm then it goes, then at 6000rpm i get cut agian.

i tried every fcd they make, is the boost cut built in the dame ecu?

dzx · Post by **dzx** » Tue May 02, 2006 3:48 am

NICO I WRX U wrote:

i am not retartd guys come on.

sorry nico but i couldnt stop laughing when i read this.

I've had the same problem with running into fuel cut even with the fcd installed.

555BCTurbo · Post by **555BCTurbo** » Tue May 02, 2006 4:37 am

You could try using a MAP pressure bleed FCD like I use...

Ever since I tuned my car I have NEVER hit fuel cut...

If interested I will draw a schematic

Splinter · Post by **Splinter** » Tue May 02, 2006 4:41 am

555BCTurbo wrote:You could try using a MAP pressure bleed FCD like I use...

Ever since I tuned my car I have NEVER hit fuel cut...

If interested I will draw a schematic

Im interested

NICO · Post by **NICO** » Tue May 02, 2006 7:51 am

dzx lol

555BCTurbo sure post it up. i cant find anything that will get rid of it. its pissing me off

IronMonkeyL255 · Post by **IronMonkeyL255** » Tue May 02, 2006 8:01 am

Where are these guys located?

NICO · Post by **NICO** » Tue May 02, 2006 2:31 pm

^^toronto ontario canada.

guys i was haveing a look at the subaru legacy service manual eletrical book, is there not a wire that i could cut to make this boost cut dissaper.

mr soul · Post by **mr soul** » Tue May 02, 2006 4:40 pm

NICO I WRX U wrote:i was on the dyno, we did a dyno tune and a street tune.

OK here is MY HUGE PROBLEM ITS KILLING ME, boost cut fuel cut what ever is stopping me to make power i what to MURDER IT.

i have made a vrg3 fcd i have a turbo smart fcd manual eltronic hks fcd none of them work i cant stop this DAME CUT. please any one have a simple idea that could help me.

i am not retartd guys come on.

All those FCD's are using the voltage reading your MAP is putting out to "clamp" the voltage at a certain point. I don't understand what exactly you did to "modify" the MAP by taking two screws out but I might look there. It seems like the problem must be what you did to the MAP.

Also, I do believe the ECU initiates fuel cut based on the MAP sensor when it sees too much pressue. Still confused though because you said you tuned to 20PSI, how if you have fuel cut issues?

mr soul · Post by **mr soul** » Tue May 02, 2006 4:57 pm

555BCTurbo wrote:You could try using a MAP pressure bleed FCD like I use...

Ever since I tuned my car I have NEVER hit fuel cut...

If interested I will draw a schematic

Are you just "bleeding" or wasting away some pressure from the MAP sensor vaccum hose? If so, I always understood that the ECU uses MAP for more than just boost cut. MAP is the best way for the ECU to recogonize "load" on the motor to adjust fuel. So while this may function, I believe you are increasing risk of going lean under certain conditions. For example lowest RPM full boost is achieved.

All the electronic FCD's act to allow the MAP to function through its intented range, however just prior to the pressue that iniates boost cut, the voltage is clamped and held constant so that the injectors can theoretically add fuel based on the other imputs the ECU reads.

my3awds · Post by **my3awds** » Tue May 02, 2006 5:02 pm

Too much air for your modified ECU, eh? Fuel cut does suck, though. Since your shop seems to be able to edit/modify your chip, it might be possible for them to remove that feature, right? I know on 90-94 dsms, you can do it. The 95-99 dsms also have DSMLink that has the option of turning it on and off on the fly. So it might be worth looking into if they are pretty good with that stuff.

I REALLY wish you could get a dyno / air:fuel graph Nico. Not because I don't believe you, but because I really want to know what your mods are doing to that engine, since I'm running a similar setup and swap. Also, it might help you in figuring out if it's possible to squeeze more HP out of less/more boost. I know that all of the AWD dyno shops here in Sacramento, CA record dyno sheets and keep them in their system for refrence for up to a year. Mustang Dyne and Dynojet. If you make it over to another shop sometime in the future, PLEASE get a sheet for me to look at. Keep us posted on your progress

douglas vincent · Post by **douglas vincent** » Tue May 02, 2006 5:03 pm

NOT MAP, MAF!

And I took the plate off the MAF, ran some data logs, and it didnt do squat! In fact, it seemed like the readings were higher.

I was able to hit 4.05 volts off boost. And on 7-8 psi, I ramped almost right up to max voltage immediately.

I just don't buy this MAF modification yet........Especially since I tried it, data logged it, and have no other proof that it works.

mr soul · Post by **mr soul** » Tue May 02, 2006 5:17 pm

douglas vincent wrote:NOT MAP, MAF!

Yeah my bad

Douglas, I'm with you on questioning this MAF mod, but with his bigger injectors he could run much higher boost without risk of maxing flow. However they would need to be trimming heavily at lower boost and RPM...its possible if they are really modifying the tables in the ECU.

As someone else said, this is a bit pointless without graphs and better data from the dyno. I know I'm interested...

georryan · Post by **georryan** » Tue May 02, 2006 5:26 pm

azn2nr wrote:i contacted neetronics right when nico made his first post.

responces were as followed

andy @ neetronics wrote:Hi Jason

Yes we custom tuned Nico's car here using the EPROM. The system that we use
here for that is car is called Techtom. As all our cars are custom tuned we
don't just sell the chips. If you have any other questions please feel free
to give me a call at the shop or send me a email.

Andy
Neetronics

Hey Jason

You can look up the tuning hardware from here www.technosquareinc.com Just
go into Techtom MT2000 the system is about $6500 USD. All the software and
hardware included with that then all you need is the chip burner and eraser
which is also on that site.

Andy
Neetronics

Hey Jason

There is also another thing you will need to get a Japanese computer from
Japan to work all these things. You will need a NEC PC98 they are easy to
find in Japan.

Andy
Neetronics
so techicnaly theres a little more to this than seems. i dont quite know how to desipher ecu models and what kind he was refering to but the moral of the story is most likely the ecu is a nissan based "chipable" ecu jdm or not. i have a hunch that the chips that nissan guys are using for their sr20 swaps are really similar to these. i also have a stronger hunch that the system is the same that is used to tune the VOS chip being that the setup is expensive to start up on. one of these days im gonna use my free canada calling adn talk to andy or paul on the phone. ive never heard of a chip set burning setup costing so much as its usualy whats noted as teh cheap way to tune so im gonna try to pump so more info.

what i want to know is how do you tell a hatachi from a jecs maf?

Am I wrong or is he not talking about an ecu but an actual japanese computer of sorts?

Project_Legacy · Post by **Project_Legacy** » Tue May 02, 2006 5:36 pm

funny. i was thinkin the same thing when i was reading that.

georryan · Post by **georryan** » Tue May 02, 2006 5:39 pm

Also, we know that this guy worked on Nico's car, and that he explained what he used to do it. I also understand the need to be cautious in what we believe, but everything he's said so far has checked out for the most part. The MAF thing might be a bit sketchy, but maybe that is a question better suited to the tuner.

Project_Legacy · Post by **Project_Legacy** » Tue May 02, 2006 6:00 pm

hey nico, do you think you need an upgraded map sensor? maybe the map sensor is getting maxed out or something. i dunno.

yea and i do believe most of whats goin on too. it would be great if everyone could have access to this tuning.

NICO · Post by **NICO** » Tue May 02, 2006 6:07 pm

^^ he siad it right, the tuner is the man. all i siad lets try it with out the plate on the back of the maf. and he siad wow it worked more table to use. who would ever think.

you guys are makeing me nuts, i will get some dyno sheets i dont no what good they are but i am going back becuse i want paul to look at this boost cut thing, so he can elimanate it FOREVER in my stock ecu.

THERE MUST BE AWAY!!!

thanks for the help guys keep the ideas going i want this ELIMANATED.

douglas vincent · Post by **douglas vincent** » Tue May 02, 2006 6:13 pm

Which "chip" did he swap out?

NONE of these chips are removable as far as I could tell. They are all soldered in.

NICO · Post by **NICO** » Tue May 02, 2006 7:37 pm

^^ he did not have to soulder no chip out, that ecu looks total diffrent from mine. but you see that open space last pic in the right middle section where a chip looks like it would go thats where. also i dont have that extra circit board to your right, just to covers for the ecu.

i will take a pic of my ecu, my year ecu is very special for some reason. i have 5 turbo ecu and all of them dont look like mine at all.

555BCTurbo · Post by **555BCTurbo** » Tue May 02, 2006 7:45 pm

It was my understanding that USDM Turbo Legacies weren't able to have their EPROMs changed...

Mr Soul, as far as the MAP sensor bleed goes, I believe it does give the ECU some idea as to the load on the motor, but as far as fueling goes, I am also running a rising rate fuel pressure regulator, and if anything, I run rich on boost, and the motor never detonates, so the bleeder type FCD seems to work great for me, at least until I get Vikash's built...

greg donovan · Post by **greg donovan** » Tue May 02, 2006 8:10 pm

NICO I WRX U wrote:^^ he did not have to soulder no chip out, that ecu looks total diffrent from mine. but you see that open space last pic in the right middle section where a chip looks like it would go thats where. also i dont have that extra circit board to your right, just to covers for the ecu.

i will take a pic of my ecu, my year ecu is very special for some reason. i have 5 turbo ecu and all of them dont look like mine at all.

are you running a standalone engine management and just dont realize it?

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Tuning the stock turbo legacy ECU