legacycentral bbs

kimokalihi wrote:Is there a filter in 1st gens? Is it hard to get too? Does the dealer still have them? This car let's every and any smell in and I hate how there's no setting for recirculating the cabin air.

Nope, there's no filter on the 1st gen legacies

Yeah I'm waiting for parts now so I can continue putting everything back together.

you been out for a bit. havent seen the little red text around. lol

Yeah I've been off for the past few weeks and haven't had much time to get on the board.

Updated pics, I ended up pulling off the rear bumper and tail lights this past weekend. I undercoated the trailer hitch area I repaired/gooped up. I haven't decided whether I'm going to undercoat the fenderwells before I put the liners back in. Thoughts?

Here are pics from this past weekend.

http://www.main.experiencetherave.com/s ... cywagon/05

I would. Makes things a little quieter, too. A LITTLE quieter. You'll still need ear plugs on certain types of concrete highway they have in the SW US. Can't remember what kind of tires I had on it, but I still remember how horribly loud the tire noise was on that surface.

Ok....I'll have to look at it and see.

Thanks for the feedback.

Steve,

I looked at it yesterday and I guess why I'm hesitant about putting undercoating on under the fenderliners is if there is rust bits I missed or didn't get well enough, the undercoating will hide it if I check or clean out the fenders in a year or so. I may just put the liners back in as is and when I check on things in a couple months/year I'll decide then what I'm going to do. I've got plenty of other stuff I need to finish, so I think I may just post pone the undercoating in the fenders for now.

When I pulled off the rear wheels yesterday I found that likely the shop that did the brakes or some shop put anti-seize on the wheel threads. Big no-no in my mind. So just another thing clean up when I do the brakes.

I don't think that's a bad idea. I'm talking from a New England perspective anyway. Once you're pretty sure there's no rust, you can use it as a sealer. Or not, as it's probably overkill in TX.

Finally got around to uploading a bunch of photos.

New Parts
Side Skirt Installation
Hella SuperTone horn & foglight installation
New brake rotors & pads
Timing belt, water pump, spark plugs, & plug wires replacement

I really dislike working on this car! It's just very frustrating...the corrosion...broken bolts....and the ridiculous fit where Subaru shoe horns ten tons of crap in a five ton hole.

The notable items were the broken brake bleeder fitting, broken alternator belt adjustment bolt (luckily I had a spare!), and timing belt cover bolt. I had new oil seals to put on, but I just didn't want to mess with them! The old ones looked alright. I found two of the plugs were very worn.

Anyway, enjoy the pics

Hey Josh. I just came across your thread right now. I'm enjoying the pics, and of course, your thoroughness in cleaning up the car "a bit." Nice looking wagon, too!

I'm sorry you're frustrated in working on the car with all the corrosion. I lived in NY for years, and yes, the salt "melds" metal together. That's why many mechanics there put anti-seize compound on the wheel threads (as Steve indicated) and other places; otherwise, some have gone through a lot more expense, time, and frustration in replacing melded parts in just trying to get the wheels (and other parts) off (as you have found out).

Some years ago, a friend mechanic of mine here in AZ had to drill, torch, and hammer parts off various parts off the brakes just to do a brake job (it was a car from CT). It took him about 6 hours. He knew I didn't have much funds so he worked around the melded parts in a way that he didn't have to order dealer-proprietary parts. After that, he advised me to sell it because he would never touch that car again. He said the next time the car needed a brake job, a shop doing it would charge me about $1,000 just for pads and maybe rotors cut. That's because the next shop doing it would simply cut, drill, and torch the parts in a way that would require new parts. Anyway, that's why mechanics in that area and other areas use anti-seize compound.

That same car kept on having rust come through it although it was now in the desert in AZ. I hadn't done anything to stop it like what you're doing for your car, because I thought the dryness wouldn't cause the rust to spread, but I was wrong. However, the car did have more rust than yours; so just keep an eye on the more severely rusted areas on your Legacy (and I know you will!).

After you get everything cleaned up and installed as you like, I hope you find pleasure in driving and maintaining the wagon!

I had a very similar amount of rust on my 2006 Impreza that was an auction car from the east coast.

Luckily I didn't like it as much as my Legacy and got out of it with a very minimal loss to buy my current Legacy which has been in WA, OR and ID it's whole life with no rust at all. I will seriously reconsider buying any vehicle from the east coast without a thorough inspection as it's just too much to deal with even for a good deal. There's always another car that fits the criteria from a non-rust state if you look for long enough.

Thanks for the comments guys.

I have started driving the car, and unfortunately, I really don't like driving it. The seats are incredibly uncomfortable, to the point of causing back pain for a 30 minute drive, and my other major gripe is the throttle response is horrible. I'm trying to not make any rash decisions. I can probably swap out the seats. The biggest issue will be finding ones that work with the airbag system. My ex had an 06 Outback, and her seats were a little better, but I still had issues on long trips. If I do replace the seats I'll probably try and find some from a newer Impreza.

On the throttle response I think I can get into the ECU via the OpenECU software and tweak the drive by wire settings. However I'm thinking, how much do I have to do to this car and spend on it.....so I don't know. I'm going to finish up the maintenance items and clean the interior up and then work on the things that just make it horrible to drive. I don't know if the throttle response is the culprit for the fact that it is a gutless SOB or if there's something else wrong. The Impreza sure feels faster.

I love the exterior looks of the car, and the interior is clean.....it's just a shame it sucks to drive.

Josh, that's the exact same reasons why I got rid of my 2006 Impreza. It was uncomfortable to drive and I hated the DBW mapping, especially on a cold engine.

It seems that all the electronic throttle cars I drive have the same garbage throttle response. It's like the computer sits and thinks for a few seconds before realizing that WOT means WO-friggin'-T. HATE electronic throttles. Cables worked perfectly. Also hate the emissions tuning that makes the engines feel like they've got 50 lbs flywheels when you put the clutch in to shift up.

Too bad about the seats! Why is it so damn hard to make comfortable seats? My 1990's were great even driving cross country, better than the SS ones I almost swapped them out for until I sat in them. The Mazda's seats turned to granite after a few hours. The Ford's are better, but the bottom side bolsters are made to fit someone with an eating disorder because they really seem to dig into my thighs after a while and it's not like I'm fat (5'11", ~170). The Civic seats are kind of stiff, too. I just don't get it.

Legacy777 wrote:
I love the exterior looks of the car, and the interior is clean.....it's just a shame it sucks to drive.

Thats disappointing to hear. I really like this generation of Legacy and was considering trying to justify buying one. Based solely on exterior styling, of course.

Here you go - http://www.sprintboostersales.com/detai ... engine=Gas - The Spring Booster! Takes care of your throttle response issues with drive-by-wire. lol I don't know how legit this is but it reminded me of your thread.

The comment about the continued rust in the AZ desert reminded me of a line from The Mountain Goats' "Against Pollution", "Decorative grating on my window gets a little rustier every year. I don't know how the metal gets rusty when it never rains here."

Yeah, the more I work on post-BC/BF/BJ Subarus I realize that Subaru has kind of lost their way with respect to serviceability. Supposedly when they designed the 89 Legacy they invited Subaru mechanics to submit a wish list and did their best to make the vehicle as easily serviceable as possible. It seems like ever since then they've been adding features and changing things up, and each change made the cars just a little harder to work on.

Still, it could be worse. I replaced the radiator in my roommate's XJ a couple months ago. It took hours. I had to use Philips drivers, Torx sockets, metric sockets, and SAE sockets. The fans barely fit between the engine so I had to finagle and bend the shrouds more than I really felt comfortable doing. The grille has to come off, and so the hood latch striker, so you have to make sure you reinstall it exactly where it came off if you want the hood to close right. Everything was hard to reach. It took longer than my last Subaru clutch job.

The Sprint Booster might do the trick, but I wonder if you could retrofit a cable-operated throttle from an earlier-model Subaru. 'Course, you'd probably have to go to an aftermarket ECU to do avoid OBD-II trouble codes and limp mode... 'Course, if you like the body and interior of the car, all you really need to do is swap in an engine you like too and you're set.

But what is it about the throttle that causes the problems, is it a delay in the throttle opening when commanded by the driver or is it a delay in fueling? I'm wondering if opening the throttle manually would even fix the problem (providing the ECU doesn't freak out, which it probably would). I'm thinking it's another emissions annoyance (and I'm generally for clean air, so this is not a normal criticism for me) to reduce acceleration enrichment. So, would opening it manually still result in hesitation as the ECU still wouldn't supply fuel or would the ECU just say, "Fuck it, the TPS is telling me to punch some fuel, so who cares that the throttle is opening faster than I'm telling it to?" Does it even have fuel maps for that?

What it does is make me either pump the gas once the wheels are rolling (which seems to help with my 2 ET cars) or beat the clutch up a little to launch it (which results in more wheel spin, which isn't good either or, in the Focus, the stupid traction control might intervene and now a semi has made my compact a subcompact, but at least they're redoing the entrance ramp that makes me jump into the barreling highway traffic from a 90* stop onto bumpy, uphill pavement).

Alphius wrote:Josh, that's the exact same reasons why I got rid of my 2006 Impreza. It was uncomfortable to drive and I hated the DBW mapping, especially on a cold engine.

Surprisingly, I think the mapping is actually more responsive when it's cold.

evolutionmovement wrote:Also hate the emissions tuning that makes the engines feel like they've got 50 lbs flywheels when you put the clutch in to shift up.

Yeah....another annoying issue....I release the clutch, engine rpms keep climbing. Plus, the poor throttle response at idle makes driving the thing like you're a clutch newbie.

kimokalihi wrote:Here you go - http://www.sprintboostersales.com/detai ... engine=Gas - The Spring Booster! Takes care of your throttle response issues with drive-by-wire. lol I don't know how legit this is but it reminded me of your thread.

That actually looks kind of interesting. I'm not sure I want to be at full throttle before full throttle, but it may be an option.


In the Subaru ECU's there are tables for the DBW pedal torque and throttle opening position. These tables are what need to be modified for the throttle response to not suck ass. I would hope that would be enough, but until you do it...who knows.

I'm going to test fit some 08 STi seats in the car this weekend and see what sort of issues I run into. If I can get the seats to work out, that will probably be the biggest challenge. I think they will physically fit, I'm just not sure about the airbag wiring/sensor. A guy on legacygt pulled apart the seat and swapped the seat sensor & airbag, but I really don't want to do that. My hope is that the connector is different, but the actual guts are the same...and in which case, I can just depin the connectors and swap them.

That's still a bit of what ifs. Then it leads me to the dbw maps. There is supposedly a beta ECU mapping for the 2006 2.5i ECU, but I haven't done enough homework to see if anyone has tried it. Assuming it's good, I would supposedly be able to buy a cable to connect to the ECU and pull down the ECU rom and adjust the DBW maps. There's an OpenECU tuner in Dallas, and I can probably just snag modified STi tables for those particular tables on my Legacy. I don't know....we'll see. Even if I can get those things fixed....right now this car and me aren't on the best of terms. That may change if those things are fixed....but who knows...