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I'd also agree with taking a step back to look for other causes. If the pinout and ECU checking don't net you anything I would also suggest checking the timing. Easy enough to do a quick check by pulling the two side t-covers off and set the crank in position.
I also wouldnt overlook the potential for a bad coolant temperature sensor...they have been known to cause several different issues with starting and drivability.

Hey Josh, I keep coming back to the code reset. Wasn't there something special regarding california specific ECU's that made code resetting difficult?

I will check the tbelt also. Coolant temp sensor was just replaced to rule all of these issues out.

The ECU isn't wired as a Cali ECU (I didn't ground that pin).

mine is having the same issue, plus code 22 for the knock sensor. im going to try the battery dance and ill update you how it runs when the ecu is reset. ive looked at the knock sensor and it doesnt appear cracked. the maf sensor is all plugged in, and appears to be wired correctly. the only difference is that my car sat outside in the rain with the windows partly down for two months by the person who stole it. no one is sure if the hood was up or down. there is a fair amount of white residue in my intake mani, and on some other metal areas in the engine bay.

I had a legacy that did the very same thing which was determined to be a bad maf. Mine got waterlogged and the maf died. Replaced the maf with one of my spares and I was up and running again.

Glad to hear you got her back!!

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yeah, ill be changing that out soo, and since the knock sensor code flashed, might as well do the for good measure.

hello subie, compare your symptoms to mine

http://bbs.legacycentral.org/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=51036

Are you sure you don't have a disconnected tube post maf? Loose hose clamp, maybe just forgot one? It happens alot

Legacy777 wrote:... What happens if you disconnect the MAF sensor before trying to start the engine?

The car will not start with it unplugged. I'm not sure if it won't start because the MAF is unplugged, or if there is a deeper issue now.

Thesubielover wrote:hello subie, compare your symptoms to mine

http://bbs.legacycentral.org/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=51036

My symptoms sound similar, but not exact. My car won't even start now. It went from running great (right after the rebuild), to stuttering and erratic idle, to major drive-ability problems (would die coming to a stop, wouldn't idle), to now not starting.

I don't think it's the MAF sensor anymore, because all the wiring checks out, and I've tried two different MAF sensors.

cj91legss wrote:Are you sure you don't have a disconnected tube post maf? Loose hose clamp, maybe just forgot one? It happens alot

I'm really hoping it's this, but I haven't found anything yet. I'm going to spray everything with starter fluid again when I have time (Christmas is beginning to make everything busy).


Also, some more info (idk if this helps): I pulled all the plugs, and they were all very fuel fouled. Cleaned them up, but not much changed.

Pulled the PCV valve house, and found this:


Pulled the intake/accordion hose, and found this:


Oil on the dipstick looked normal

Thanks again everyone for helping out.

Looks like you May need a new turbo real soon

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cj91legss wrote:Looks like you May need a new turbo real soon

The sad thing is, I just purchased this from a board member that said it was hardly used and it great shape. When I received it, I checked for shaft play, and it had none whatsoever. I've been ripped off a few times though. Is there any way to just replace the seals in it instead of buying a whole new one?

When your car shutters, is it when trying to accelerate, and does it start running super rich?

Its possible. You could buy a rebuild kit and maybe rebuild it yourself. You'll have to have the shaft balanced after you get the cartridge back together. But is a vf11 really worth having?

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There could also be a problem with your pcv system too

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Thesubielover wrote:When your car shutters, is it when trying to accelerate, and does it start running super rich?

It stutters almost all the time: idle, cruise. WOT there is no power. I don't have a WB, so idk how rich it is, but judging by the nose test and looking at how gray/black the exhaust is, it runs super rich all the time (when it ran).

cj91legss wrote:Its possible. You could buy a rebuild kit and maybe rebuild it yourself. You'll have to have the shaft balanced after you get the cartridge back together. But is a vf11 really worth having?

It's a TD05 turbo. I'd like to try to salvage it since I already purchased it. Who can balance the shaft, any machine shop? Or is it a turbo specific shop?

cj91legss wrote:There could also be a problem with your pcv system too

What problems could PCV have? I put in a brand new PCV valve, and replaced most of the hoses. I know one of the PCV hoses that goes to one of the valve covers is cracked, could that cause an issues?


Also, I got a compression tester today, to hopefully rule out anything major. I'll post back results when I get a chance to do the test.

Thanks again.

turboleg wrote:Hey Josh, I keep coming back to the code reset. Wasn't there something special regarding california specific ECU's that made code resetting difficult?

That issue I believe was specifically related to the codes not clearing due to the canister purge solenoid being bad. Once the purge solenoid was replaced, the codes were able to be cleared.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this picture a picture of the turbo inlet hose? If so, I don't see how that much oil got in the hose from the inlet side of the turbo.



I would check how the PCV system is hooked up, and/or verify the engine is working ok. I don't know if you've already done this, but have you checked that the timing belt is still timed properly?

^ Josh, you are correct. That is the turbo inlet hose. I wasn't thinking about oil pre/post turbo, so yeah, that oil isn't from the turbo, it's from PCV as far as I can tell. There isn't much oil between the turbo and TB.

The PCV system should be plumbed correctly, I followed this picture:



I also read your post on the PCV system this morning that I found interesting as well: http://bbs.legacycentral.org/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=50906

I think the reason for that much oil from PCV is either from the rings breaking in and and there's a lot of blow-by from it, or it's because one of my PCV hoses from the heads are cracked (hose #8 at the head above).

I'll continue troubleshooting tomorrow when it's light out again.

I'd suggest checking the PCV hoses. When I've broken in my motors, even with forged pistons, never got that much oil come through.

Let us know what you find out.

Just an update: I found the problem is that the injectors are stuck open constantly. I'm not sure why yet, but I'm guessing it's something wiring related (maybe bad ground or chaffed wire somewhere). I'll have more time to investigate on the 1st or next weekend.

Does anyone have any injector wiring diagrams, or are they all in the FSM? Can anyone tell me what ground the injectors use, because I know there are several ECU grounds?

Also, I found one cracked PCV hose that I'll be replacing.

how did find out the injectors are staying open? mine may be doing the same thing

Thesubielover wrote:how did find out the injectors are staying open? mine may be doing the same thing

There is constantly +12v between the pins on the harness at the injectors.

So if I unplug my injector wires, where would I run my volt meter leads to read the volts? Did you check all four injectors? THey seem very easy to get to with the air box off, and the battery/windshield washer fluid resivor.

hellosubaru wrote:

Thesubielover wrote:how did find out the injectors are staying open? mine may be doing the same thing

There is constantly +12v between the pins on the harness at the injectors.

There is supposed to be a 12v constant at one of the pins going to the injectors. The ECU "sinks" current rather than supplying it. Transistors tend to work better and last longer this way.

Depending on the year you got your harness from, the early 90's were setup to have a 12v constant going to the injectors, while the post face lift Legacies had an ignition switched 12v going to the injectors. The other lead on the injector goes to the ECU.

Do you know what year harness you are running?

im running a 93 ss harness