legacycentral bbs

Not sure if I posted on here, my initial problems........here's a quick run down.

Two weekends ago I ran a 4 step cleaner shit through my engine. First part goes in the fuel, second part get's sucked in to the intake through vacuum, third part goes in the oil, (what I was told was that it is likes vicks vapor rub for your engine....cleaning pcv system and such. Fourth part is a throttle body spray......nothing really different then throttle body cleaner.

Well after I had gotten done spraying the throttle body cleaner in the intake.....and cleaning all the carbon away from the butterfly and such......my idle was quite a bit higher......1100-1300 rpm when in neutral or park. When I put it in gear, idle drops to about 800 or so....but I've gotta hold my foot on the brake a lot more steady......or the car will just start idling away due to the high idle.

Since the initial problem.....Here's a couple things I've noted and noticed while trying to diagnose.

When the car is cold in the morning....it starts normally....idle jumps up to around 2000, then calms back down to normal high idle speed. If I give it some gas....and get the idle to bump back down.....it'll come down to almost normal....about 800 or so.....when in neutral or park.

Other thing it does....and sorta has been doing for some time. If I start it up.....and don't let it warm up for a while......put it in gear and go to accelerate, the idle drops....car sputters and putts for a couple seconds......then idle kicks back up to normal high idle. If I don't touch the gas, and put it in gear and let it coast away.....it doesn't do it.....only when I touch the gas, and when it is "cold" It has done this for a while....like 4 years or so....it had seemed to be more pronounced if I ran premium fuel. I normally run mid-grade, 89.

Some of the stuff I've done to try and trouble shoot. I've tried sprayin throttle body cleaner and such around the engine....to look for air leaks....none seemed to surface....

I've disconnected the plug from the IAC valve, and idle jumps up and is really rough.

I've also taken the top electronic piece off, and manual controlled the rotary valve....didn't seem to bring back into check to well either.

Latest thing I've done is taken the air intake goin into the IAC valve off the intake arm and see what happens......idle drops a little bit....like 100 rpm....but nothing much........I then plugged the IAC valve hose......again....a tad lower then when it's normally hooked up....but not back to normal.

The one weird thing was......when I got it plugged up, and go to start the car......the idle will jump to about 1000, then settle to where it should be....stay there for a couple seconds then just kick back up to 1000-1100 rpm........it's like it's working fine....then ECU is getting signal for something, and tries to correct something that shouldn't be.

I have/had been pretty animate about the IAC valve being bad. There is actually two portions to it (for the AT models only). There is an electromagnet portion that fine tunes the idle with a rotary valve type thing. The other portion is a bimetallic strip that is hooked up to the lower portion of the valve.....it has coolant lines running to it.....as coolant heats up....it will close another valve before the rotary valve to cut the air off.

Haynes says this thing should be completely closed when the car is hot. Only thing is I don't think it's "totally" closed.....or the electronic portion wouldn't serve a function.....but there's a longer portion where I think it closes......I believe this is also working properly....probed a screw driver in there to feel where the valve was.

I've tested the electronic portion according to the manual, and everything checks out.

I just picked up a IAC valve off of a 94 motor......I was goin to try and swap it in......it looks in so-so shape....only reason I'm hesitant is because there is rust inside the portion where the coolant lines go.....I don't really want that stuff in my cooling system.

I'm starting to question whether it is actually the valve or not......because I plugged it.......and it still had a high idle......

I've played around with a new TPS too.....however I've since put the old one back on.....and put it exactly where it used to be......I've even re-adjusted it back to specs....according to the Haynes manual.

I've got some brake cleaner, and actual carb & choke cleaner which I may try and use to search for vacuum leaks.

Do you think any of the cleaner stuff fubared the O2 sensor.....or anything else......I just can't see what would cause such a problem......only thing I can think of is there was gunk somewhere......that was blocking a leak or something.....now it's not there.........

I really want to get this fixed........I need some feedback on what others think.

Really appreciate it.

Thanks

Josh
************************************
Josh Colombo
<mailto:Josh@surrealmirage.com> Josh@surrealmirage.com

"Life, an ever-changing melody
of beats and rhythm" - ME
************************************




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zZz <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .

It does sound like the IAC valve try tapping on it with something when
the high idle problem is evident if it slows suddenly the valve
is probably bad these valves have a bearing in them that goes away and
it can get intermittant. Any excessive play or wear in the shaft and
bearings for the throttle plate? try tapping on this also and see what
happens the plate can bind a bit at times.
throttle cable? rare but I have seen it. Most of this miracle cleaning
crap just moves some of the dirt around so You can't see it as far as
I can tell. This weekend is the big test or the chip,ECU, and headers
Sat drag race, Sun autocross, Mon dyno.
AL(CO)



--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "Josh Colombo" <josh@s...> wrote:
> Not sure if I posted on here, my initial problems........here's a
quick run down.
>
> Two weekends ago I ran a 4 step cleaner shit through my engine.
First part goes in the fuel, second part get's sucked in to the intake
through vacuum, third part goes in the oil, (what I was told was that
it is likes vicks vapor rub for your engine....cleaning pcv system and
such. Fourth part is a throttle body spray......nothing really
different then throttle body cleaner.
>
> Well after I had gotten done spraying the throttle body cleaner in
the intake.....and cleaning all the carbon away from the butterfly and
such......my idle was quite a bit higher......1100-1300 rpm when in
neutral or park. When I put it in gear, idle drops to about 800 or
so....but I've gotta hold my foot on the brake a lot more
steady......or the car will just start idling away due to the high
idle.
>
> Since the initial problem.....Here's a couple things I've noted and
noticed while trying to diagnose.
>
> When the car is cold in the morning....it starts normally....idle
jumps up to around 2000, then calms back down to normal high idle
speed. If I give it some gas....and get the idle to bump back
down.....it'll come down to almost normal....about 800 or so.....when
in neutral or park.
>
> Other thing it does....and sorta has been doing for some time. If I
start it up.....and don't let it warm up for a while......put it in
gear and go to accelerate, the idle drops....car sputters and putts
for a couple seconds......then idle kicks back up to normal high idle.
If I don't touch the gas, and put it in gear and let it coast
away.....it doesn't do it.....only when I touch the gas, and when it
is "cold" It has done this for a while....like 4 years or so....it
had seemed to be more pronounced if I ran premium fuel. I normally
run mid-grade, 89.
>
> Some of the stuff I've done to try and trouble shoot. I've tried
sprayin throttle body cleaner and such around the engine....to look
for air leaks....none seemed to surface....
>
> I've disconnected the plug from the IAC valve, and idle jumps up and
is really rough.
>
> I've also taken the top electronic piece off, and manual controlled
the rotary valve....didn't seem to bring back into check to well
either.
>
> Latest thing I've done is taken the air intake goin into the IAC
valve off the intake arm and see what happens......idle drops a little
bit....like 100 rpm....but nothing much........I then plugged the IAC
valve hose......again....a tad lower then when it's normally hooked
up....but not back to normal.
>
> The one weird thing was......when I got it plugged up, and go to
start the car......the idle will jump to about 1000, then settle to
where it should be....stay there for a couple seconds then just kick
back up to 1000-1100 rpm........it's like it's working fine....then
ECU is getting signal for something, and tries to correct something
that shouldn't be.
>
> I have/had been pretty animate about the IAC valve being bad. There
is actually two portions to it (for the AT models only). There is an
electromagnet portion that fine tunes the idle with a rotary valve
type thing. The other portion is a bimetallic strip that is hooked up
to the lower portion of the valve.....it has coolant lines running to
it.....as coolant heats up....it will close another valve before the
rotary valve to cut the air off.
>
> Haynes says this thing should be completely closed when the car is
hot. Only thing is I don't think it's "totally" closed.....or the
electronic portion wouldn't serve a function.....but there's a longer
portion where I think it closes......I believe this is also working
properly....probed a screw driver in there to feel where the valve
was.
>
> I've tested the electronic portion according to the manual, and
everything checks out.
>
> I just picked up a IAC valve off of a 94 motor......I was goin to
try and swap it in......it looks in so-so shape....only reason I'm
hesitant is because there is rust inside the portion where the coolant
lines go.....I don't really want that stuff in my cooling system.
>
> I'm starting to question whether it is actually the valve or
not......because I plugged it.......and it still had a high idle......
>
> I've played around with a new TPS too.....however I've since put the
old one back on.....and put it exactly where it used to be......I've
even re-adjusted it back to specs....according to the Haynes manual.
>
> I've got some brake cleaner, and actual carb & choke cleaner which I
may try and use to search for vacuum leaks.
>
> Do you think any of the cleaner stuff fubared the O2 sensor.....or
anything else......I just can't see what would cause such a
problem......only thing I can think of is there was gunk
somewhere......that was blocking a leak or something.....now it's not
there.........
>
> I really want to get this fixed........I need some feedback on what
others think.
>
> Really appreciate it.
>
> Thanks
>
> Josh
> ************************************
> Josh Colombo
> <mailto:Josh@s...> Josh@s...
>
> "Life, an ever-changing melody
> of beats and rhythm" - ME
> ************************************


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Thanks Al,

I'll give some parts a tapping on tomorrow. I'm goin to replace the gasket behind the IAC valve as well....it has been updated to a new style....there's a possibility I could have a leak at the bottom.

Other thing is I pulled the line for the O2 sensor......nothing happened....the car didn't change idle speed....didn't do shit.....CEL didn't even come on. I'm wondering if the thing is not getting out of open loop mode.....and going into closed loop.

I'm goin to try and take some readings on that thing tomorrow as well. If it is the O2 sensor.......I can pretty well attribute it to the cleaning crap.....said company is goin to buy me a new O2 sensor......or I will be calling AMEX to see if they can take away payment to them.

Josh

************************************
Josh Colombo
Josh@surrealmirage.com <mailto:Josh@surrealmirage.com>

"Life, an ever-changing melody
of beats and rhythm" - ME
************************************


-----Original Message-----
From: milehial2000 [mailto:acroxford@hypermall.net]
Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2002 98 PM
To: BC-BFLegacyWorks@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: high idle saga continues.....(little
long)


It does sound like the IAC valve try tapping on it with something when
the high idle problem is evident if it slows suddenly the valve
is probably bad these valves have a bearing in them that goes away and
it can get intermittant. Any excessive play or wear in the shaft and
bearings for the throttle plate? try tapping on this also and see what
happens the plate can bind a bit at times.
throttle cable? rare but I have seen it. Most of this miracle cleaning
crap just moves some of the dirt around so You can't see it as far as
I can tell. This weekend is the big test or the chip,ECU, and headers
Sat drag race, Sun autocross, Mon dyno.
AL(CO)



--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "Josh Colombo" <josh@s...> wrote:
> Not sure if I posted on here, my initial problems........here's a
quick run down.
>
> Two weekends ago I ran a 4 step cleaner shit through my engine.
First part goes in the fuel, second part get's sucked in to the intake
through vacuum, third part goes in the oil, (what I was told was that
it is likes vicks vapor rub for your engine....cleaning pcv system and
such. Fourth part is a throttle body spray......nothing really
different then throttle body cleaner.
>
> Well after I had gotten done spraying the throttle body cleaner in
the intake.....and cleaning all the carbon away from the butterfly and
such......my idle was quite a bit higher......1100-1300 rpm when in
neutral or park. When I put it in gear, idle drops to about 800 or
so....but I've gotta hold my foot on the brake a lot more
steady......or the car will just start idling away due to the high
idle.
>
> Since the initial problem.....Here's a couple things I've noted and
noticed while trying to diagnose.
>
> When the car is cold in the morning....it starts normally....idle
jumps up to around 2000, then calms back down to normal high idle
speed. If I give it some gas....and get the idle to bump back
down.....it'll come down to almost normal....about 800 or so.....when
in neutral or park.
>
> Other thing it does....and sorta has been doing for some time. If I
start it up.....and don't let it warm up for a while......put it in
gear and go to accelerate, the idle drops....car sputters and putts
for a couple seconds......then idle kicks back up to normal high idle.
If I don't touch the gas, and put it in gear and let it coast
away.....it doesn't do it.....only when I touch the gas, and when it
is "cold" It has done this for a while....like 4 years or so....it
had seemed to be more pronounced if I ran premium fuel. I normally
run mid-grade, 89.
>
> Some of the stuff I've done to try and trouble shoot. I've tried
sprayin throttle body cleaner and such around the engine....to look
for air leaks....none seemed to surface....
>
> I've disconnected the plug from the IAC valve, and idle jumps up and
is really rough.
>
> I've also taken the top electronic piece off, and manual controlled
the rotary valve....didn't seem to bring back into check to well
either.
>
> Latest thing I've done is taken the air intake goin into the IAC
valve off the intake arm and see what happens......idle drops a little
bit....like 100 rpm....but nothing much........I then plugged the IAC
valve hose......again....a tad lower then when it's normally hooked
up....but not back to normal.
>
> The one weird thing was......when I got it plugged up, and go to
start the car......the idle will jump to about 1000, then settle to
where it should be....stay there for a couple seconds then just kick
back up to 1000-1100 rpm........it's like it's working fine....then
ECU is getting signal for something, and tries to correct something
that shouldn't be.
>
> I have/had been pretty animate about the IAC valve being bad. There
is actually two portions to it (for the AT models only). There is an
electromagnet portion that fine tunes the idle with a rotary valve
type thing. The other portion is a bimetallic strip that is hooked up
to the lower portion of the valve.....it has coolant lines running to
it.....as coolant heats up....it will close another valve before the
rotary valve to cut the air off.
>
> Haynes says this thing should be completely closed when the car is
hot. Only thing is I don't think it's "totally" closed.....or the
electronic portion wouldn't serve a function.....but there's a longer
portion where I think it closes......I believe this is also working
properly....probed a screw driver in there to feel where the valve
was.
>
> I've tested the electronic portion according to the manual, and
everything checks out.
>
> I just picked up a IAC valve off of a 94 motor......I was goin to
try and swap it in......it looks in so-so shape....only reason I'm
hesitant is because there is rust inside the portion where the coolant
lines go.....I don't really want that stuff in my cooling system.
>
> I'm starting to question whether it is actually the valve or
not......because I plugged it.......and it still had a high idle......
>
> I've played around with a new TPS too.....however I've since put the
old one back on.....and put it exactly where it used to be......I've
even re-adjusted it back to specs....according to the Haynes manual.
>
> I've got some brake cleaner, and actual carb & choke cleaner which I
may try and use to search for vacuum leaks.
>
> Do you think any of the cleaner stuff fubared the O2 sensor.....or
anything else......I just can't see what would cause such a
problem......only thing I can think of is there was gunk
somewhere......that was blocking a leak or something.....now it's not
there.........
>
> I really want to get this fixed........I need some feedback on what
others think.
>
> Really appreciate it.
>
> Thanks
>
> Josh
> ************************************
> Josh Colombo
> <mailto:Josh@s...> Josh@s...
>
> "Life, an ever-changing melody
> of beats and rhythm" - ME
> ************************************



To unsubscribe from this group, please send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com









------------------------ ---------------------~-->
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and no minimums.
FREE Money 2002.
http://us.click.yahoo.com/k6cvND/n97DAA ... /XoTolB/TM
---------------------------------------------------------------------~->

To unsubscribe from this group, please send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com

Not sure if I posted on here, my initial problems........here's a quick run down.

Two weekends ago I ran a 4 step cleaner shit through my engine. First part goes in the fuel, second part get's sucked in to the intake through vacuum, third part goes in the oil, (what I was told was that it is likes vicks vapor rub for your engine....cleaning pcv system and such. Fourth part is a throttle body spray......nothing really different then throttle body cleaner.

Well after I had gotten done spraying the throttle body cleaner in the intake.....and cleaning all the carbon away from the butterfly and such......my idle was quite a bit higher......1100-1300 rpm when in neutral or park. When I put it in gear, idle drops to about 800 or so....but I've gotta hold my foot on the brake a lot more steady......or the car will just start idling away due to the high idle.

Since the initial problem.....Here's a couple things I've noted and noticed while trying to diagnose.

When the car is cold in the morning....it starts normally....idle jumps up to around 2000, then calms back down to normal high idle speed. If I give it some gas....and get the idle to bump back down.....it'll come down to almost normal....about 800 or so.....when in neutral or park.

Other thing it does....and sorta has been doing for some time. If I start it up.....and don't let it warm up for a while......put it in gear and go to accelerate, the idle drops....car sputters and putts for a couple seconds......then idle kicks back up to normal high idle. If I don't touch the gas, and put it in gear and let it coast away.....it doesn't do it.....only when I touch the gas, and when it is "cold" It has done this for a while....like 4 years or so....it had seemed to be more pronounced if I ran premium fuel. I normally run mid-grade, 89.

Some of the stuff I've done to try and trouble shoot. I've tried sprayin throttle body cleaner and such around the engine....to look for air leaks....none seemed to surface....

I've disconnected the plug from the IAC valve, and idle jumps up and is really rough.

I've also taken the top electronic piece off, and manual controlled the rotary valve....didn't seem to bring back into check to well either.

Latest thing I've done is taken the air intake goin into the IAC valve off the intake arm and see what happens......idle drops a little bit....like 100 rpm....but nothing much........I then plugged the IAC valve hose......again....a tad lower then when it's normally hooked up....but not back to normal.

The one weird thing was......when I got it plugged up, and go to start the car......the idle will jump to about 1000, then settle to where it should be....stay there for a couple seconds then just kick back up to 1000-1100 rpm........it's like it's working fine....then ECU is getting signal for something, and tries to correct something that shouldn't be.

I have/had been pretty animate about the IAC valve being bad. There is actually two portions to it (for the AT models only). There is an electromagnet portion that fine tunes the idle with a rotary valve type thing. The other portion is a bimetallic strip that is hooked up to the lower portion of the valve.....it has coolant lines running to it.....as coolant heats up....it will close another valve before the rotary valve to cut the air off.

Haynes says this thing should be completely closed when the car is hot. Only thing is I don't think it's "totally" closed.....or the electronic portion wouldn't serve a function.....but there's a longer portion where I think it closes......I believe this is also working properly....probed a screw driver in there to feel where the valve was.

I've tested the electronic portion according to the manual, and everything checks out.

I just picked up a IAC valve off of a 94 motor......I was goin to try and swap it in......it looks in so-so shape....only reason I'm hesitant is because there is rust inside the portion where the coolant lines go.....I don't really want that stuff in my cooling system.

I'm starting to question whether it is actually the valve or not......because I plugged it.......and it still had a high idle......

I've played around with a new TPS too.....however I've since put the old one back on.....and put it exactly where it used to be......I've even re-adjusted it back to specs....according to the Haynes manual.

I've got some brake cleaner, and actual carb & choke cleaner which I may try and use to search for vacuum leaks.

Do you think any of the cleaner stuff fubared the O2 sensor.....or anything else......I just can't see what would cause such a problem......only thing I can think of is there was gunk somewhere......that was blocking a leak or something.....now it's not there.........

I really want to get this fixed........I need some feedback on what others think.

Really appreciate it.

Thanks

Josh
************************************
Josh Colombo
<mailto:Josh@surrealmirage.com> Josh@surrealmirage.com

"Life, an ever-changing melody
of beats and rhythm" - ME
************************************




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zZz <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .

Not sure if I posted on here, my initial problems........here's a
quick run down.

Two weekends ago I ran a 4 step cleaner shit through my engine.
First part goes in the fuel, second part get's sucked in to the
intake through vacuum, third part goes in the oil, (what I was told
was that it is likes vicks vapor rub for your engine....cleaning pcv
system and such. Fourth part is a throttle body spray......nothing
really different then throttle body cleaner.

Well after I had gotten done spraying the throttle body cleaner in
the intake.....and cleaning all the carbon away from the butterfly
and such......my idle was quite a bit higher......1100-1300 rpm when
in neutral or park. When I put it in gear, idle drops to about 800
or so....but I've gotta hold my foot on the brake a lot more
steady......or the car will just start idling away due to the high
idle.

Since the initial problem.....Here's a couple things I've noted and
noticed while trying to diagnose.

When the car is cold in the morning....it starts normally....idle
jumps up to around 2000, then calms back down to normal high idle
speed. If I give it some gas....and get the idle to bump back
down.....it'll come down to almost normal....about 800 or so.....when
in neutral or park.

Other thing it does....and sorta has been doing for some time. If I
start it up.....and don't let it warm up for a while......put it in
gear and go to accelerate, the idle drops....car sputters and putts
for a couple seconds......then idle kicks back up to normal high
idle. If I don't touch the gas, and put it in gear and let it coast
away.....it doesn't do it.....only when I touch the gas, and when it
is "cold" It has done this for a while....like 4 years or so....it
had seemed to be more pronounced if I ran premium fuel. I normally
run mid-grade, 89.

Some of the stuff I've done to try and trouble shoot. I've tried
sprayin throttle body cleaner and such around the engine....to look
for air leaks....none seemed to surface....

I've disconnected the plug from the IAC valve, and idle jumps up and
is really rough.

I've also taken the top electronic piece off, and manual controlled
the rotary valve....didn't seem to bring back into check to well
either.

Latest thing I've done is taken the air intake goin into the IAC
valve off the intake arm and see what happens......idle drops a
little bit....like 100 rpm....but nothing much........I then plugged
the IAC valve hose......again....a tad lower then when it's normally
hooked up....but not back to normal.

The one weird thing was......when I got it plugged up, and go to
start the car......the idle will jump to about 1000, then settle to
where it should be....stay there for a couple seconds then just kick
back up to 1000-1100 rpm........it's like it's working fine....then
ECU is getting signal for something, and tries to correct something
that shouldn't be.

I have/had been pretty animate about the IAC valve being bad. There
is actually two portions to it (for the AT models only). There is an
electromagnet portion that fine tunes the idle with a rotary valve
type thing. The other portion is a bimetallic strip that is hooked
up to the lower portion of the valve.....it has coolant lines running
to it.....as coolant heats up....it will close another valve before
the rotary valve to cut the air off.

Haynes says this thing should be completely closed when the car is
hot. Only thing is I don't think it's "totally" closed.....or the
electronic portion wouldn't serve a function.....but there's a longer
portion where I think it closes......I believe this is also working
properly....probed a screw driver in there to feel where the valve
was.

I've tested the electronic portion according to the manual, and
everything checks out.

I just picked up a IAC valve off of a 94 motor......I was goin to try
and swap it in......it looks in so-so shape....only reason I'm
hesitant is because there is rust inside the portion where the
coolant lines go.....I don't really want that stuff in my cooling
system.

I'm starting to question whether it is actually the valve or
not......because I plugged it.......and it still had a high idle......

I've played around with a new TPS too.....however I've since put the
old one back on.....and put it exactly where it used to be......I've
even re-adjusted it back to specs....according to the Haynes manual.

I've got some brake cleaner, and actual carb & choke cleaner which I
may try and use to search for vacuum leaks.

Do you think any of the cleaner stuff fubared the O2 sensor.....or
anything else......I just can't see what would cause such a
problem......only thing I can think of is there was gunk
somewhere......that was blocking a leak or something.....now it's not
there.........

I really want to get this fixed........I need some feedback on what
others think.

Really appreciate it.

Thanks

Josh



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Hmm.. I reckon most of those engine additives are bad news...

Anyway, have you tried checking the error codes on the ECU? It might be able
to tell you something.

You might be right about the O2 sensor being bad -- I had something like
that happen to me on another car when i screwed the mixtures up.
The car ran badly, but the CE light only came on occaisionally. Checked the
codes, it said O2, put new O2 in, problem fixed.

Dunno if its the sort of thing you'd have lying around as a spare, but if
you can find someone with one, i'd be trying to swap it in n see what
happens.

Toby

On Thu, 18 Apr 2002, Josh Colombo wrote:

> Not sure if I posted on here, my initial problems........here's a quick run down.
>
<snip>


------------------------ ---------------------~-->
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Could be it is the O2 sensor but here is something else to check. In
at least some of the throttle body assemblies there are a few small
passages in the bottom of the throat did that cleaner wash some dirt
down there? I still don't think very much about the Mechanic in a can
stuff. If you should have to take the TB off I would recommend
resisting the urge to turn the little screw on the bottom. The factory
says if this is misadjusted the TB should be thrown in the trash and I
agree as about all this ever does is make matters worse. I think I
have a O2 sensor around that you could try if you want but they can be
checked with a inexpensive digital multimeter the voltage out should
be between about 0 and 1.2 volts when hot and move all over the place.
AL(CO)




--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., Toby Corkindale <tjcorkin@s...> wrote:
> Hmm.. I reckon most of those engine additives are bad news...
>
> Anyway, have you tried checking the error codes on the ECU? It might
be able
> to tell you something.
>
> You might be right about the O2 sensor being bad -- I had something
like
> that happen to me on another car when i screwed the mixtures up.
> The car ran badly, but the CE light only came on occaisionally.
Checked the
> codes, it said O2, put new O2 in, problem fixed.
>
> Dunno if its the sort of thing you'd have lying around as a spare,
but if
> you can find someone with one, i'd be trying to swap it in n see
what
> happens.
>
> Toby
>
> On Thu, 18 Apr 2002, Josh Colombo wrote:
>
> > Not sure if I posted on here, my initial problems........here's a
quick run down.
> >
> <snip>


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actually.....ya know I may still have the old O2 sensor.....I believe it was still good....car had 100,000+ miles on it with orig O2 sensor....so I wanted to replace.

No real codes.....other then me unplugging sensors to see what happens.....that'll throw a code for sure.......except the O2 sensor.....I got no code when I pulled that.......which is why I'm wondering about it.....when the car is warmed up.....it should be in closed loop mode and getting readings from O2 sensor....however it looks like it's not......I'll try to get some on-the-fly readings from O2 sensor and see if the readings are similar to what they should be....for being in closed loop mode.

Josh

-----Original Message-----
From: Toby Corkindale [mailto:tjcorkin@sa.pracom.com.au]
Sent: Fri 4/19/2002 12:22 AM
To: BC-BFLegacyWorks (E-mail)
Cc:
Subject: Re: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] high idle saga continues.....(little long)



Hmm.. I reckon most of those engine additives are bad news...

Anyway, have you tried checking the error codes on the ECU? It might be able
to tell you something.

You might be right about the O2 sensor being bad -- I had something like
that happen to me on another car when i screwed the mixtures up.
The car ran badly, but the CE light only came on occaisionally. Checked the
codes, it said O2, put new O2 in, problem fixed.

Dunno if its the sort of thing you'd have lying around as a spare, but if
you can find someone with one, i'd be trying to swap it in n see what
happens.

Toby

On Thu, 18 Apr 2002, Josh Colombo wrote:

> Not sure if I posted on here, my initial problems........here's a quick run down.
>
<snip>


------------------------ ---------------------~-->
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and no minimums.
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yeah I've heard same about not touching that screw.....I know it's a no-no screw......it's a possibility about those passages......

I'll see what I can find this weekend.

Josh

-----Original Message-----
From: milehial2000 [mailto:acroxford@hypermall.net]
Sent: Fri 4/19/2002 84 AM
To: BC-BFLegacyWorks@yahoogroups.com
Cc:
Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: high idle saga continues.....(little long)



Could be it is the O2 sensor but here is something else to check. In
at least some of the throttle body assemblies there are a few small
passages in the bottom of the throat did that cleaner wash some dirt
down there? I still don't think very much about the Mechanic in a can
stuff. If you should have to take the TB off I would recommend
resisting the urge to turn the little screw on the bottom. The factory
says if this is misadjusted the TB should be thrown in the trash and I
agree as about all this ever does is make matters worse. I think I
have a O2 sensor around that you could try if you want but they can be
checked with a inexpensive digital multimeter the voltage out should
be between about 0 and 1.2 volts when hot and move all over the place.
AL(CO)




--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., Toby Corkindale <tjcorkin@s...> wrote:
> Hmm.. I reckon most of those engine additives are bad news...
>
> Anyway, have you tried checking the error codes on the ECU? It might
be able
> to tell you something.
>
> You might be right about the O2 sensor being bad -- I had something
like
> that happen to me on another car when i screwed the mixtures up.
> The car ran badly, but the CE light only came on occaisionally.
Checked the
> codes, it said O2, put new O2 in, problem fixed.
>
> Dunno if its the sort of thing you'd have lying around as a spare,
but if
> you can find someone with one, i'd be trying to swap it in n see
what
> happens.
>
> Toby
>
> On Thu, 18 Apr 2002, Josh Colombo wrote:
>
> > Not sure if I posted on here, my initial problems........here's a
quick run down.
> >
> <snip>


------------------------ ---------------------~-->
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and no minimums.
FREE Money 2002.
http://us.click.yahoo.com/orkH0C/n97DAA ... /XoTolB/TM
---------------------------------------------------------------------~->

To unsubscribe from this group, please send an email to:
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The main problem with that kind of stuff is that it claims
to "restore lost horsepower" and other such things. What people don't
realize is that they have no "lost horsepower". I would not advise
using any of that stuff unless there is a specific problem that you
are trying to solve. 95 and newer auto tranny legacys have a problem
with the cruise control, which causes exactly what you describe. I
have not heard any reports of this problem in the 1990 though.
Perhaps you have replaced with some parts from a 95 and caused the
problem that way?

The occasional bottle of fuel injector cleaner may help keep things
in good shape, but I would stay away from things like zMax.
Apparently it does nothing at all except drain your wallet.

--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "Josh Colombo" <josh@s...> wrote:
> yeah I've heard same about not touching that screw.....I know it's
a no-no screw......it's a possibility about those passages......
>
> I'll see what I can find this weekend.
>
> Josh
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: milehial2000 [mailto:acroxford@h...]
> Sent: Fri 4/19/2002 84 AM
> To: BC-BFLegacyWorks@y...
> Cc:
> Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: high idle saga continues.....
(little long)
>
>
>
> Could be it is the O2 sensor but here is something else to
check. In
> at least some of the throttle body assemblies there are a few
small
> passages in the bottom of the throat did that cleaner wash
some dirt
> down there? I still don't think very much about the Mechanic
in a can
> stuff. If you should have to take the TB off I would recommend
> resisting the urge to turn the little screw on the bottom.
The factory
> says if this is misadjusted the TB should be thrown in the
trash and I
> agree as about all this ever does is make matters worse. I
think I
> have a O2 sensor around that you could try if you want but
they can be
> checked with a inexpensive digital multimeter the voltage out
should
> be between about 0 and 1.2 volts when hot and move all over
the place.
> AL(CO)
>
>
>
>
> --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., Toby Corkindale <tjcorkin@s...>
wrote:
> > Hmm.. I reckon most of those engine additives are bad
news...
> >
> > Anyway, have you tried checking the error codes on the ECU?
It might
> be able
> > to tell you something.
> >
> > You might be right about the O2 sensor being bad -- I had
something
> like
> > that happen to me on another car when i screwed the
mixtures up.
> > The car ran badly, but the CE light only came on
occaisionally.
> Checked the
> > codes, it said O2, put new O2 in, problem fixed.
> >
> > Dunno if its the sort of thing you'd have lying around as a
spare,
> but if
> > you can find someone with one, i'd be trying to swap it in
n see
> what
> > happens.
> >
> > Toby
> >
> > On Thu, 18 Apr 2002, Josh Colombo wrote:
> >
> > > Not sure if I posted on here, my initial
problems........here's a
> quick run down.
> > >
> > <snip>
>
>
> ------------------------ ---------------
------~-->
> Buy Stock for $4
> and no minimums.
> FREE Money 2002.
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/orkH0C/n97DAA ... /XoTolB/TM
> --------------------------------------------------------------
-------~->
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, please send an email to:
> BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@e...
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/


------------------------ ---------------------~-->
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Well....this stuff is not like zmax.....basically the first stuff is like fuel injector cleaner.....the stuff that caused the problem is just throttle body cleaner.....which is when the problem occurred.......I haven't replaced anything.......It's something to do with that cleaner shit.......no if's or buts.....I just haven't figured out yet for sure what the problem is.....I'm leaning towards O2 now

Tested it....it was running .9 volts at idle....almost consistently....which is full rich. Plus it was the only sensor that did nothing to change how the car ran when I unplugged it. It didn't even through a CEL.

We'll find out tomorrow.....as I didn't feel like searing my flesh on the hot exhaust manifold

Josh

************************************
Josh Colombo
Josh@surrealmirage.com <mailto:Josh@surrealmirage.com>

"Life, an ever-changing melody
of beats and rhythm" - ME
************************************


-----Original Message-----
From: DNA_Man [mailto:dna_man@yahoo.com]
Sent: Friday, April 19, 2002 6:32 PM
To: BC-BFLegacyWorks@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: high idle saga continues.....(little
long)


The main problem with that kind of stuff is that it claims
to "restore lost horsepower" and other such things. What people don't
realize is that they have no "lost horsepower". I would not advise
using any of that stuff unless there is a specific problem that you
are trying to solve. 95 and newer auto tranny legacys have a problem
with the cruise control, which causes exactly what you describe. I
have not heard any reports of this problem in the 1990 though.
Perhaps you have replaced with some parts from a 95 and caused the
problem that way?

The occasional bottle of fuel injector cleaner may help keep things
in good shape, but I would stay away from things like zMax.
Apparently it does nothing at all except drain your wallet.

--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "Josh Colombo" <josh@s...> wrote:
> yeah I've heard same about not touching that screw.....I know it's
a no-no screw......it's a possibility about those passages......
>
> I'll see what I can find this weekend.
>
> Josh
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: milehial2000 [mailto:acroxford@h...]
> Sent: Fri 4/19/2002 84 AM
> To: BC-BFLegacyWorks@y...
> Cc:
> Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: high idle saga continues.....
(little long)
>
>
>
> Could be it is the O2 sensor but here is something else to
check. In
> at least some of the throttle body assemblies there are a few
small
> passages in the bottom of the throat did that cleaner wash
some dirt
> down there? I still don't think very much about the Mechanic
in a can
> stuff. If you should have to take the TB off I would recommend
> resisting the urge to turn the little screw on the bottom.
The factory
> says if this is misadjusted the TB should be thrown in the
trash and I
> agree as about all this ever does is make matters worse. I
think I
> have a O2 sensor around that you could try if you want but
they can be
> checked with a inexpensive digital multimeter the voltage out
should
> be between about 0 and 1.2 volts when hot and move all over
the place.
> AL(CO)
>
>
>
>
> --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., Toby Corkindale <tjcorkin@s...>
wrote:
> > Hmm.. I reckon most of those engine additives are bad
news...
> >
> > Anyway, have you tried checking the error codes on the ECU?
It might
> be able
> > to tell you something.
> >
> > You might be right about the O2 sensor being bad -- I had
something
> like
> > that happen to me on another car when i screwed the
mixtures up.
> > The car ran badly, but the CE light only came on
occaisionally.
> Checked the
> > codes, it said O2, put new O2 in, problem fixed.
> >
> > Dunno if its the sort of thing you'd have lying around as a
spare,
> but if
> > you can find someone with one, i'd be trying to swap it in
n see
> what
> > happens.
> >
> > Toby
> >
> > On Thu, 18 Apr 2002, Josh Colombo wrote:
> >
> > > Not sure if I posted on here, my initial
problems........here's a
> quick run down.
> > >
> > <snip>
>
>
> ------------------------ ---------------
------~-->
> Buy Stock for $4
> and no minimums.
> FREE Money 2002.
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/orkH0C/n97DAA ... /XoTolB/TM
> --------------------------------------------------------------
-------~->
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, please send an email to:
> BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@e...
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/



To unsubscribe from this group, please send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com









------------------------ ---------------------~-->
Buy Stock for $4
and no minimums.
FREE Money 2002.
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---------------------------------------------------------------------~->

To unsubscribe from this group, please send an email to:
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