legacycentral bbs

Well, I've had some time to drive the car since my swap, and something just doesn't seem right.

I noticed something last weekend when driving around. Second gear just didn't seem to be "sliding" into gear all the way, and seemed rather stiff. All the other gears felt fine, including first. I really hadn't noticed this before last weekend. I'm not sure what was different.

I was out driving last night and noticed the same thing. All the gears were a little stiff due to the cold weather until things warmed up. After that it felt the same way as before. I still also have issues with grinding when going to 1st to 2nd when accelerating fast. The thicker/colder oil does help, but it still feels stiff.

Second gear just doesn't feel right. I don't know what the problem is.....unfortunately, unless I pulled the tranny and opened up the case, there's really nothing I can figure out. I don't think changing the oil will do anything either. There's no telling I'd actually see anything if I took it apart either. I think if I did take it apart, I'd probably put a different 2nd gear set in.

I don't know what to do.....this just sucks!

thoughts?

What fluid are you using?

If you have grinding problems, I'd likely say it's a synchro problem. If it doesn't feel like it's engaging properly, it could be the bearings around the synchro, rather than the synchro itself. If a few of them seize, they can stiffen up the synchro from sliding all the way into the collar. This can cause partially engaged dog's, and leaves the transmission vulnerable to damage.

Dog teeth are VERY strong, but even they will break. Partially engaged puts them at risk. A little peice of chipped metal could wreak havoc on the transmission.

I use Redline 75W90NS in my tranny, and it feels GREAT.

I'm using NEO synthetic 75w90.

I had valvoline dino in before.

I had some more grinding issues with the dino, not just in 2nd gear. When I switched to NEO, everything went away except the 2nd gear issues.

The transmission was rebuilt by richard buckner, and replaced the synchros & some of the bearings. I'd have to check to see if he replaced all of them, or just a few.

It's hard to explain exactly how it feels. I wish I had someone near by that could drive it.

BAC5.2 wrote:
I use Redline 75W90NS in my tranny, and it feels GREAT.

thats the ticket

Redline is junk, I've been through this before, it's all in my stickied thread at the top of this forum. It only works in colder temperatures because it's thick enough to cause enough friction in the synchros. Otherwise (read: in warm temps like mine) it will make things worse and just cause more grinding.

Josh, I dunno what else to say except get used to it, and also realize your short-throw shifter might be making it worse. This is a Subaru transmission, and an older one at that. Doesn't matter if it's been rebuilt, it's just the way it's designed. I've learned to deal with it, and even in the rare occasion I get on it, I do have to force 2nd gear in but it still doesn't grind, coz I know when too much pressure is too much pressure.

If you all think OUR trannies are grumpy, drive an 80's Subaru. Even the most gentle driver can still make them grind occasionally. I grind my XT's 3rd sometimes, even when just driving normally. When I drove avatar382's monster XT Turbo with the RX D/R tranny and a short-throw shifter, I ground almost every gear if I tried to shift too fast, and that still wasn't slamming anything around.

subyluvr2212 - That was your experience, but it's not universal. Phil's synchros became a lot more effective when he put in Redline 75W90NS. And mine became a lot more effective -- before I changed the fluid I could barely get into 2nd gear at all, and now I can't make it grind even when I try a little to shift hard.

Josh - Rour problem is just during the shift? Does the shift feel better when it's a downshift or when it's an upshift, or is it the same? What about if you double-clutch?

Maybe the transmission isn't breaking in right with synthetic lube. Or maybe it's just about broken in now and needs a fluid change.

Fluid is different for every transmission. That's the one thing I can say with pretty good confidence is so many people have so many different experience with different fluids. No one fluid is going to be the magic cure.

I've driven 80's subarus. My dad had an 87 wagon. It shifted fine.

I agree, the short shifter may not be helping, but there is one thing that is common during any time I have grinding issues. It only happens if I accelerate quickly. I only get grinding during the upshift between 1st to 2nd, during the accelerating condition. It is really not rpm dependent.

There is something more at work here, because I don't have grinding issues in any other gear after changing to the NEO fluid.

The stiffness I mentioned is something I only noticed recently. Two weekends ago was the first time I noticed it. It also seemed to happen during my trip/drive. It feels sort of like it's not going all the way in gear, even though it is all the way in gear

I've looked into the diagrams and the parts replaced on the transmission a little more closely.

As for parts that have been replaced.....on the main shaft & driven shaft, the only thing that was replaced was the baulk rings, and the lock nuts on the end of the shafts. The only bearings to be replaced were the four in the extension housing.

Now to some questions regarding bearing issues, etc that were brought up.

First, reverse, and second gear on the main shaft are part of the main shaft, and therefore I would assume the main shaft does not move, and it's the driven shaft that does the moving to align with the proper gear. Am I correct in assuming this?

That would mean that if there is a bearing/bushing issue, it would be on the driven shaft.

If you look at part 20 on this scan
http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8 ... n_assy.jpg

It is the 2nd driven gear bush. That is the only thing I can see from looking at this diagram that might cause a stiffness if it were worn, or if any of the components that touch it are worn/galled.

I really wish I had more room in the garage, I would've loved to take apart the MT & AT trannies to get a much better idea of how everything works. Probably would help in trying to diagnose this issue.

I spent the better part of the afternoon reverse engineering a manual pneumatic control system that was put in sometime during the 70's, and how the new automatic pneumatic control system would work in its place. It was pretty interesting.

BTW, here's the main shaft blow-up if anyone is interested
http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8 ... t_assy.jpg

I hate to say it but I also think it is just a normal Subaru 5MT.
My 02 WRX sounds like it's about the same as yours.
I will play with some different fluid sometime but I just don't shift real fast anymore.

You know what's weird. I let a friend drive it on thursday. He's got an 04 WRX. He said he didn't notice anything out of the ordinary, other then the shifter requiring a little more effort. But that's normal with a short shifter.

I drove it after he did, and it didn't feel the same it did earlier when I posted this. I don't what the hell is goin on.

Maybe it's the magic of a WRX driver on your short shifter.

Just kidding, though that would be nice. Heck, maybe it's a coincidence that it decided to break in more while your friend was driving it, to the point where you didn't notice it when you got it back.

Maybe you subconsciously thought it felt better because your friend wasn't bothered by it. The human mind is funny like that. And subaru tranny's are just bad like that.

I don't know.....