legacycentral bbs

my buddy just upgraded to a deadbolt IHI on his 02 WRX and is giving me his stock 16g turbo and 440 injectors for $50 (they have 30k on them). i know they will work with some adjustment to the compressor elbow from searching around but i recently read that my stock vf11 isnt much smaller than the 16g in his WRX. is that right? im building this car for a GRM challenge car and so far im keeping everything budgeted out perfectly. will this turbo net me in the 250 crank HP range without any complex EMS? a company here Gram Bending is making me custom headers/exhaust as well as turbo elbow modification fpr $300. what i want to know is it worth the money to invest in this turbo or is it a dead end venture for power? thanx

First thing...that turbo isn't a 16g iirc...its a TD04...

I would say go for it, its quite a bit larger than the VF11...and would easily net you your 250hp (providing you mean at the crank)

Yeah do it. $50 bucks, you cant beat it.

Plus once you make the neccesary modifications to adapt this turbo, any of the bigger IHI turbos are basically a bolt-on deal. You could probably sell this turbo at a profit at that point.

555BCTurbo wrote:First thing...that turbo isn't a 16g iirc...its a TD04...

I would say go for it, its quite a bit larger than the VF11...and would easily net you your 250hp (providing you mean at the crank)

It's a TD04-13g. It is BARELY any larger than the VF11 and would probably only put you 10hp past what the VF11 could take you to.

If you mod it to fit, you could sell it again for 30 bucks. TD04's are almost free on Nasioc.

The only modification you need is to acheive the 90 degree inlet. You would have to mod any IHI turbo to do this.

ok so that makes more sense. what about boring the compressor out and fitting a new wheel?has anyone played around with any hybrid 13g/16gor 18g? the turbo is dirt cheap and i would like to keep it int he project if possible. making a hybrid turbo would be much cheaper than buying a newer more effeciant one, or am i missing some great deals?

also BAC5.2 what modifications have you made to your ss if you dont mind tell me? i ask because yers seems about where i want mine at 250 crank etc.

I thought it was a TDO4-13t

id throw on the wrx top mount while your at....

Would a tdo4 be way more efficient at 1 bar than stock turbo though? don't wrx run 12 or 13psi?

i believe they are good for 15-18 psi correct. so i would think 1 bar (14.7) wouldnt be a problem. so anyone else know the limits of the turbo?

I know that the td04 can push 14.7. but does it do it much more efficiently than the stocker? don't turbos just blow crazy hot air once they get out of the efficient range? i figure asking our stock units to push more than 12 is making them blow way hot air.

Sk3oSH wrote:will this turbo net me in the 250 crank HP range without any complex EMS?

People have given you some good comments on most of your questions. But as a side note about EM, I think that to generate 250 hp, you're already starting to step over the line into EM territory regardless of what turbo you use.

BAC5.2 wrote:
It's a TD04-13g. It is BARELY any larger than the VF11 and would probably only put you 10hp past what the VF11 could take you to.

The TD04-13g certainly flows enough for at least 220hp (as it makes that much on the WRX).

The VF11 is quite small, so small that it will loose pressure approaching redline on a stock EJ22T, but it’s a production car and Subaru did a great job matching the turbo to typical road driving... puts the punch where you can feel it on your drive to work. I think the TD04 would be about all the turbo the stock EM could ever make use of, like Sam said your gonna need some kinda extra EM to get to 250hp. Then there’s the heads, if you have ever seen the chambers/valves/ports of the EJ22T heads compared to the WRX or 2.5 twincams you’ll realize that the EJ22T will probably require more boost pressure than the stock TD04 (13.5?) just to get up to the 220hp point.

In the end it’s a system, and beyond small tweaks, changing one part without addressing all the others will rarely give optimum results.

Gary

well i meant anything involving splicing the harness or something very expensive do to my budget. i will be adding a RRFPR when i change out the injectors as well so in a sense that will be my EM a simple FMU. its worked very well on everyother car i run in the challenge and how easy it is to tune by just the turn of a bleed screw makes all the difference. it was also only $27 on ebay! its a B.E.G.I RRFPR (Bell Engineering). r there any simple head swap that can be done to help wth air flow. can i find something in the $150-200 range that'll work?

I think you could get 250 hp with just a rrfpr and a FCD...I was pushing 19 psi with my VF11 Inbred on stock injectors with just an afpr and a walbro pump and before I get flamed for doing this...it NEVER pinged. I would go with a VF8 if I were you...I just put one on my car and it is an awesome turbo, and quite a bit larger than the VF11...and I got mine for $115!

The VF8 is good option, it comes off the JDM Turbo Liberty I believe, which is also likely to be the cheapest source for decent flowing twin cam heads (tho I’m not sure there as good as the WRX/RS heads). BTW, the turbo Liberty’s run 410-440cc injectors and were rated at about 220hp. But I’m thinking this head swap will cost you about twice your $150-200 budget.

Eric at Frantic Four in Tacoma is running Liberty heads with the 440 injectors, a VF39 (USDM STI turbo), big TMIC and FCD on the stock ECU in his ’91 SS. He told me he figures he’s near 250hp and after some learning the ECU has things trimmed in well enough to pass emissions.

Gary

where might i find liberty or rs heads for cheap?

The TD04-13g certainly flows enough for at least 220hp (as it makes that much on the WRX).

all in the heads, all in the heads

Sk3oSH wrote:where might i find liberty or rs heads for cheap?

seconded i want liberty or wrx heads though.

any idea what compression will be with the liberty heads

call me a newb but... RRFPR?

Psychoreo wrote:call me a newb but... RRFPR?

Rising Rate Fuel Pressure Regulator

o...got it

aka fmu

td04 on ej205 wrx is known to easily make 300 crank.

about 240ps/235ft-lb on dynopack @ 17psi. some peopel have gone as high as 275wheel on various dynos, but thats obviously with every bolt on under the sun on a stock ej205.

full management is a must.

however, iirc cfm is dependant on the motor as well, so cfm on a stocker ej22t and a ej207 with the same turbine would be worlds apart.

power is in the heads yo.

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