legacycentral bbs

Hello all, man it's been a long time since I've been on the board. I hope all is well with the board members. I haven't parsed through the posts so I don't know who's active anymore but I think about the speed n feed's that Matt used to have sometimes. Anyway... here's my dealio.

My car died last night on the way home. It just kind of sputtered to a stop and then nothing. It won't turn over, it won't even struggle to turn over. My first thought was the fuel pump so I took the line coming from the filter under the hood off and pressed the gas. Fuel came gushing out so I ruled that out. Checked the spark coming from the coil pack...got spark from all four. At that point I gave it up for the night and went home. Today I came back to my poor turboleg and tried to turn it over, hoping against hope that it might start. No such luck. So, here's a list of Codes...

21 - water temp sensor
22 - knock sens
23 - Maf
32 - O2 sens
41 - a/f leaning control ?
45 - MAP atmosphere sens
49 ??? no idea - four long blinks nine short ones.

So I checked the fuel pump. checked for spark. Took out the MAF and cleaned it with MAF cleaner and I checked the vacuum hoses. I'm lost but I'm leaning towards the MAF because of the way it won't turn over. I recall that when you try to start the car with the MAF disconnected it acts the same way. Oh, I also took off the timing belt cover to see if the timing belt was turning and it was so that might rule out the crank sensor. One thing, I have a rear CV that clunking (needs replaced badly) so I put in the FWD fuse for the ride home fearing that the CV might go out on me. I don't know if this matters but I think not because one other time when I did that it was hot out and I got an 'At Oil Temp' light. I shut the car off immediately and let it sit for an hour or so. It started right up. Even then the car would start, just not move. Any ideas?? I need help desperately. Thanks

Update: I found the code for 49. I just overlooked it. That too is an air flow sensor code. That really makes me suspect an open circuit.

I'm off to replace the knock sensor.

Nope. What I'm wondering is will a car not start due to an opened MAF?

Well iv never tried starting my car without the MAF connected. But i have seen it happen before on other cars. They were on OBD ll cars so this is just a for instance. But they would turn over... go through the self check and then die after like 3 seconds. I would think even if it was the MAF that it would at least crank over stutter and then die. The fact that its not cranking at all sounds electrical to me. Unless you mean crank no start. Either way, by how many systems seem to be affected, still sounds electrical. Becuase the car would at least run, if not totally crappy, with a bad knock, o2, and even the atmospheric sensor. IDK if if any of these systems are connected electrically except through the ECU. But my guess would be to check all of your grounds, especially the ECU ground! Which can be found under the driver side fuel rail. Its really really hard to see, but if you remove the windshield washer fluid resevoir you can get a better view. If that thing came loose it would raise all sorts of hell with all of those systems because i think they all use the 5v reference the ECU puts out. No ground, no reference. Thats just my late night right before bed input. GL.

Thanks for the input, I'll check that out. It's weird, it just kind of sputtered to a halt and that was it. I HATE to think the ECU went as I don't have another anymore. But it is still throwing codes. Judging by the content of the codes it does seem likely to be the maf but we'll see.

It wasn't the MAF. A guy I know came and looked at it and it looks like it either jumped time drastically or a cam went out on me. I pray it's a slipped belt, although it's tight, the cam angle or crank sensor because if it isn't I might as well throw myself under a bus.

Scott,

Can you please clarify whether you mean the engine will not spin/turn/crank over, or whether you just mean it won't start.

The multiple codes are just likely false codes, and I wouldn't get too worried about them. Try clearing the codes by pulling the EGI/TCU fuse (No 14) for about an hour. Put it back, and then check the codes again. Before clearing the codes, try just the green connectors to run the "active diagnostic" tests.

I'd also suggest checking the timing belt. Have you checked the oil, does it look black and does it have any metal flakes in it?

The engine would spin, as in it the crank would turn but the sound of it trying to turn over was all wrong. It didn't sound like the timing was right when trying to turn over. The problem was resolved after a couple tries. It turns out that the tensioner pulley was shot on both sides and the one of the timing pulleys as well. The bolts holding all of the above were stripped from the last repair job. The timing belt jumped too and was almost 180 degrees out of phase with broken teeth. After the first repair job I drove it from the shop and it broke down again. That was the tensioner pulley on the driver side. It was a huge ordeal. Now it's throwing more codes and making a whirring noise that seems to be coming from the driver's side cam. I don't know. I'm prepping my spare engine for swap in case it goes. I'm so over this car but it's all I have. I just don't want to put another thousand dollars into it. It's been a bitch ever since I bought it from a guy on the board.

That sucks about the tensioner. Was it the tensioner pulley or idler pullies? There's only one tensioner pulley, but two idler pullies and one idler gear.