legacycentral bbs

Hi guys,

I just rebuilt my ej22T. Main components replaced as follows: crank and rod/main bearings, piston rings, oil pump, and gasket kit. I used all OEM parts.

Rebuild went really well, and I installed a RobTune 550 ECU and 4to2 Converter, N/A fuel rails, sti yellow tops, VF39, and JECS MAF.

I left all three connectors behind the battery un-plugged to prime the motor and make sure it didn't sound like a bunch of metal being thrown into a recycling bin. I turned it over and it sounded great, so I plugged in the connectors and turned the key forward. The car immediately acted like it was in test mode, lots of relays clicking, erratic check engine light, and cooling fans clicking on intermittently. I turned it off and made sure the connectors were not connected and it was not in test mode. They weren't connected, it wasn't in test mode. Tried to start it, it cranked fine again but wouldn't fire. I had spark and fuel pressure, so I thought it could be an ECU issue.

The next day I decided to take out the converter and 20g ECU and plug in my old ej22t ECU and try to start it with the JECS MAF and sti yellowtops. Same story, cranked but wouldn't fire. Had spark and fuel, again. I figured this was a long shot because of the bigger MAF and Injectors, so I swapped the old MAF and old injectors/fuel rails back in. Still the same story, spark and fuel pressure, won't fire.

Moral of the long story is that my car is back to the way it ran when I pulled it into my garage to pull the motor. And now it won't start, but I still have spark and fuel.

I'm stumped. It now throws codes 35 and 49 with the stock ECU. I had the purge solenoid removed since I was going with the Robtune, so the first time I tried to start it the solenoid wasn't there. Same story with the MAF, I tried to start it with the JECS but it now has the correct MAF. I assume neither of these codes would stop it from starting though, is this correct? I disconnected the battery for a while but it won't clear the codes.

My first thought was timing, but I've done a few timing belt jobs and never had a problem. I checked it anyway, and it was indeed correct. I took it off and counted the teeth, it was still correct, so it's back on and it's right. I also have 12v to one pin and 5v to the other on the car side of the MAF plug. If I'm reading the diagram right this is also correct.

Any ideas on where to go next? It's got spark, fuel, correct timing, what more does it need? I'm thinking about going to the junkyard and looking for another coil, ingnitor, and MAF and replacing them one by one. How would they go bad from being removed and installed though?

Sorry for the ramblings...any help is greatly appreciated!

Thanks,

Keats

Sounds like you have gone through everything but think simple and back track and double check. It is probably something dumb haha that you would think about.

Make sure that you did indeed plug those 3 connectors back together. Make sure that your fuel pump plug is connected and you hear the pump priming. Make sure you have the MAF plug connected and all the hoses connected for the intake and whatnot.

Make sure you haven't flooded the motor. Perhaps take the plugs out, make sure they are the proper gaps and try again.

Hopefully you get this resolved cause I know how frustrating it can be when you are so close.

Can you share how you're verifying you have proper spark & fuel?

I haven't verified either has proper timing, all spark plugs have spark when grounded and are soaked in fuel after attempting to start. I've looked through your site and the FSM, haven't seen a troubleshooting section that matches my symptoms. From what I understand the signal for the injectors comes directly from the ecu. Is there a way to test latency that I'm not seeing in the manual? What would I do if the injectors received the wrong signal, replace the ecu? Doesn't seem right that both my stock ecu and the robtune would be faulty.

Are you sure the timing is right? if you have spark and fuel it should be running...

I agree with Robert on checking the timing. A common issue is folks install the timing belt using the arrow on the front of the crank gear vs. the mark on the back.

This is the proper mark:
http://main.experiencetherave.com/subar ... G_2710.JPG
http://main.experiencetherave.com/subar ... G_2701.JPG

You can see the arrow on the front of the crank gear in this pic:
http://main.experiencetherave.com/subar ... G_2720.JPG

I'm sure the timing belt is correct, here's a few pictures of how I lined up the marks. Disregard the nail polish...it's from counting the teeth when the belt was on the first time. Timing has been correct the entire time.

Left -


Center -


Right -

Looks good to me.

When you crank it, does it try and sputter at all? or does it crank over and over with no change?

Pretty much just cranks away. I once noticed a slight sputter on the first crank the morning after I had let it sit all night. Other than that, it just cranks and cranks. I thought the one time sputter was odd...not sure how that could happen randomly.

Are you sure you haven't put the plugs for injectors on the wrong way around. Same goes for ignition leads

Also double check all your earthing points

I matched up the injector connectors via color of wires to the FSM since the cylinder code tags were not readable. Spark plug wires are not supposed to cross, correct? Grounding points are all grounded as well.

Besides looking at the color of wires for the injectors you can use a multimeter to check the resistance of the wire back to the ECU to determine the correct injector plug.

The spark plug wires are not supposed to cross.

I know you said you've verified the plugs have fuel on them, but it may be a good idea to verify the fuel pressure while cranking the engine to make sure there is appropriate pressure.

Of the 3 main plugs going to the engine, one is exclusively grounds and terminates at a bolt on the manifold. Have you verified these wires are in fact grounding, and the bolt is tight? This happened to me, a minorly loose bolt causing intermittent clicking of relays, and a no start..

Also, how's your battery. It is putting out the right voltage, and can pass a load test? No possibility of loose connections there, especially on the negative terminal?

Legacy777 wrote:Can you share how you're verifying you have proper spark & fuel?

Josh, what is the best way to check for spark?

Stick your tongue on the coil and have a friend crank it. Lol!

The way I check, is have someone crack the car over and pull a plug off the coilpack, hold the boot close to the coilpack and you should be able to see the spark between the coil and the boot. If that makes sense...

Did you hook up your fuel lines correctly?

Yeah, what CJ said^^^^^^^

robertpaige wrote:The way I check, is have someone crack the car over and pull a plug off the coilpack, hold the boot close to the coilpack and you should be able to see the spark between the coil and the boot. If that makes sense...

I think it makes sense.

You are saying: remove one plug wire from the coil pack, hold it in the air close enough so the spark arcs from the coil pack through the air into the plug wire, and you can see it. Right?

Rubber boots required?

Yeah! And yes rubber boots, or you'll end up shocking yourself a lil bit haha.

Rubber boots on the plugs.. I'm sure like rain boots might help idk. Hahaha I wear Vans and never have shocked myself..

Dynamic Entry wrote:

Legacy777 wrote:Can you share how you're verifying you have proper spark & fuel?

Josh, what is the best way to check for spark?

Pulling a wire off the coil was an easy and effective way to check for spark. (I had fat spark arching over an inch to the plug wire)

So what about Fuel?


I know my pump is pushing fuel to the fuel filter (it sprayed when a line was disconnected), but I am not confident that fuel is getting into the cylinders.

I tried pulling a plug, but there is some oil getting past the valve cover o-rings, so my plugs are wet/dirty/smelly with oil making it hard to tell if they are getting wet with fuel...


So what is the best way to check for fuel at the cylinder?

Well first you should check to make sure the injectors are working properly. If your injectors aren't working you won't get any fuel to Te cylinder. And if you're sure the fuel lines are correct and there's fuel being pumped, that's the only thing between the fuel line and the cylinder.

This thread is officially hijacked I guess.

The injectors were rebuilt less than 2 years ago, so I don't suspect them.

I am currently thinking that an ECU/wiring issue is the cause of the problem.

That could cause the injectors to not work correctly, no?

I am 100% sure the lines are correct (nothing changed, years of operation).

I am 100% sure that fuel is pumping (it sprayed with force from line IN to fuel filter)