Matt Monson I need your help here. I have a choice here and I can't find any info that really stands. Which is the better turbo; VF8, VF10, or early TDO4? My mech. has all 3 in the shop off him JDM units and I have my choice? HELP...
I'm building a USDM '91 Legecy Turbo 2.2T w/Forester XT I/C for autocross. So I'm trying to find the best of both worlds; spool and cfm/boost.
Any help would be great!!
Lastly I'm trying to find info on the RS-RA motor. This was the gold valve cover unit fron Japan correct? What were the defining factors of this unit? They used the same large combustion chamber as the EJ20G... Craig at the shop has one, bearings are gone on the block though. He thinks that there's nothing special about this unit. Also think that it had the TD04 on it...don't know if this was OE or altered by prior owner.
Thanks,
-Matt A
Last edited by advansti on Thu Oct 27, 2005 5:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
Get me pictures of the engine and I can tell you what it is. If he thinks there is nothing special about it, buy it for a song and tell him later what a great deal you got. But no RS-RA ever came with a TD04. They got VF-8's or VF-12 depending on if they were JDM or Export.
On the turbos, there is a thread by THAWA at the bottom of this forum (last thread on page 1) with a bunch of specs and things. But of your options, I would go TD05...
1974 Porsche 914 Cam Am Limted Edition AKA the Bumble Bee
1973 Porsche 914 2.0 l -Suby swap pending
1968 Porsche 911t survivor 47k original miles
2000 2.5RS daily driver.
1999 2.5RS w/ 50+ extra whp
Suby Hai!
I run a TD05H-16G and I can tell you that I don't think it would be the ideal turbo for AutoX. It would be the best of the 3 for overall performance though.
The VF10, I hate to say, would probably be the best of the 3 for AutoX because of the quicker spooling characteristics.
The VF8 would probably add more oomph up high but spool a bit slower (later) and the 16G would give the best oomph up high but take the longest to spool.
My power doesn't come on until around 3k rpms with the 16G but then it will pull like a raped ape all the way to redline.
-Matt
'92 SS 5mt. All go and no show. Sold :(
'94 Audi UrS4 Modded (new project)
'96 Outback 5mt.
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[quote="Redlined"]
Oh... and I hope the fucker get bunked with Gunter, arrested for raping Gorillas.[/quote]
I think the TD05 would be best for you because of its mix between spool and power. I think is creates a little more power than VF-8 and it has a newer bearing design so it has a quicker spool. VF11-2700RPM, TD05-3000RPM, VF8-3300RPM. If anyone thinks differently, please tell me. I have a VF8 that will be on my car pretty soon and i am a little worried because i have been doing really well in Rallycross with the VF11 and i am worried that if i change to the VF8 the later spool will affect my times.
-maximus
94 legacy Silver Touring Wagon now w/ 5spd, Ground Controls, ej20g, rear VLSD, td05, and edms.
95 impreza Rally car. 3.0 H6
88 Toyota fj62 OME lift.
Thanks for all the information. Although I was misinformed and it was a TD04 w/a 90deg. inlet housing that was available. The reason for the swapping of turbos is simplify the install of the I/C. Also for hopes of increasing the CFM keeping the lag to a minimum w/the I/C.
Again does anyone know the CFM of any of these turbos at a given psi and psi efficiency? Still weighing my options.
-Matt
I have a 16G and yes, it's the best turbo out of the 3 BUT I still don't think it's the best for AutoX, where you never get out of first and second gear and will rarely if ever get to redline in second.
I think the quicker spool characteristics of the smaller VF11 and VF10 would be better for the autox.
-Matt
'92 SS 5mt. All go and no show. Sold :(
'94 Audi UrS4 Modded (new project)
'96 Outback 5mt.
'07 Legacy 2.5i SE
[quote="Redlined"]
Oh... and I hope the fucker get bunked with Gunter, arrested for raping Gorillas.[/quote]
A td04 with 90 degree inlet would be pretty good, but I still think a TD05 would be better.
I don't think the spooling characteristics of the turbo are going to play that big of deal. The added power is really where it is at.
Max, did you ever ride in Mark's car when he still ran the Ej22T and had a Garrett turbo in there? That car dominated the auto-x for a number of years. His spool up was in the 3000's in those days.
Now I am no auto-x expert, but I really think it is about being able to hit your powerband and keep it there. What rpm that hits at really isn't that important once you get the car off the line...
1974 Porsche 914 Cam Am Limted Edition AKA the Bumble Bee
1973 Porsche 914 2.0 l -Suby swap pending
1968 Porsche 911t survivor 47k original miles
2000 2.5RS daily driver.
1999 2.5RS w/ 50+ extra whp
Suby Hai!
if your gonna be autox'ing this car id recomend the td04. i have a tdo5-16g and i absolutely hate hate hate autox'ing it. and its not like our corses are tight and small either, i hate racing it on large wide open pads too.
you can probaly get little over 200hp off the ej22t with that turbo ported and poloished with a little head work, but one thing is still for cirtian, unless you can get your car down to 2600 pounds you wont even be close to competive in streetmod which will most likely be the class you will be competting in.
-jason
[quote="Scoobyniteowl"] Chasin' @$$ is a great form of exercise and if you do get any, then that is more exercise[/quote]
azn2nr wrote:if your gonna be autox'ing this car id recomend the td04. i have a tdo5-16g and i absolutely hate hate hate autox'ing it. and its not like our corses are tight and small either, i hate racing it on large wide open pads too.
vrg3 wrote:I don't remember the exact engine speed, but I don't start making boost until somewhere around 3000 RPM.
Are you doing that on the stock heads? Or did you install my old Ej20G heads. I have never heard from you where you went with your build or seen an update anywhere...
1974 Porsche 914 Cam Am Limted Edition AKA the Bumble Bee
1973 Porsche 914 2.0 l -Suby swap pending
1968 Porsche 911t survivor 47k original miles
2000 2.5RS daily driver.
1999 2.5RS w/ 50+ extra whp
Suby Hai!
Now other than the reasons I stated above is the fact that I'm getting one of these turbos; VF8, VF10, or TD04 for $50... Now you can see why I'm looking into these options. As stated before I'm looking into my options to also 'fill' the I/C as fast as possible...lag as far as CFM.
My td04 has ridiculous spool up, but it definately loses it up top. And I have had it ported and polished and ceramich coated. I am thinking I am going to do the same to the Td05 that I plan to get and that should help wit hthe "slower spool up. The td04s spool is great but I think I want something that pulls a little longer that will take advantage of my new cams and ecu.
2011 Mini Countryman S All4
1970 Honda Ct90
2001 Forester S of Doom - mowed down by a Cummins
1994/5/6/01/02/03/04/06/07/08 Impregacy OUtback SS STi Type R money pit- NEW RALLYCAR!!
91 Pearl White Sport Sedan
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87 Grey GL-10 Sedan (so long old buddy) - donated
97 Toyota 4Runner SR5 - sold
2002 BMW r1150rt-p - sold
2004 BMW r1200ST - sold
2016 BMW r1200RS - sold
I talked to Frazer and he is hitting 16 psi of boost by 3200 rpms on the vf8 on his 2.0 engine. Has anyone tried both the vf8 and the TD05 on the same engine?
91 Pearl White Sport Sedan
04 Java Black Pearl Forester XT
2014 Volvo S60 T5
18 KTM 1290 Adventure S
87 Grey GL-10 Sedan (so long old buddy) - donated
97 Toyota 4Runner SR5 - sold
2002 BMW r1150rt-p - sold
2004 BMW r1200ST - sold
2016 BMW r1200RS - sold
2011 Mini Countryman S All4
1970 Honda Ct90
2001 Forester S of Doom - mowed down by a Cummins
1994/5/6/01/02/03/04/06/07/08 Impregacy OUtback SS STi Type R money pit- NEW RALLYCAR!!
I'm just gonna drop two cents here, remember its a Sysyem...
The stock EJ22T heads dont flow very well in the top end, so match them with a turbo that spools in there power range, I think the the VF12 and TD04 would be better, maybe the VF8.
If you're gonna do some head work or use a set of twin cams, step up to the VF8 or TD05, dropp a gear and tach it up.
Trouble is most AutoX courses are set up to keep you in 2ed gear the whole time and you may not be able to keep the higher RPM setup in its working range... again its a system, power range needs to match gearing and course.
Gary
No matter how broke I am... I always seem to find two cents.
