Crazy starting issues

Post by **Legacy777** » Thu Jan 09, 2003 4:06 am

Recently I've been having some weird issues with my car. The thing will not start some times in the morning.

However if I turn on the driving lights or headlights for a second I can start the car. This afternoon it wouldn't start no matter what I did.......I waited several minutes.....tried again and left the driving lights on and it started.

I had the battery and alternator tested. They both checked out as good. I'm pretty sure it's some sort of bad connection. I cleaned the battery terminals. I'm planning on trying to clean the ground points and pos. connection on the starter this weekend.

Other option after that is to run/replace the line goin to the starter for POS. I've got multiple lines for the other neg. leads, and pos lead from alternator.

Here's a more in depth thread cause I'm too lazy to type everything out
http://www.ultimatesubaru.net/forum/sho ... eadid=2447

any comments or suggestions

morgie · Post by **morgie** » Thu Jan 09, 2003 5:03 am

humm, is the engine revving ? if so, check that nasty plug under the rear-seat, plug for the Gas Pump...

mine failed and car wouldn't start, but was intermittent..

We simply bypassed the plug with Radio-Shack el-Cheapo connectors

Post by **Legacy777** » Thu Jan 09, 2003 3:01 pm

Car runs fine....(well for the most part....not fuel related)

Actually trying to start it is where the problem lies. The starter won't even turn over at times.

entirelyturbo · Post by **entirelyturbo** » Thu Jan 09, 2003 4:03 pm

Bad starter contacts? I bought my car with that problem... In the morning, it would only click, if you fiddled around with the key enough and had good reflexes, it would sometimes try to crank, and if you noticed and kept the key in the Start position, it just might turn over...

This was not a problem if you tried to start the car when the engine was warm though...

If that's so, get a rebuilt starter. I had mine installed for $130 about 2 1/2 years ago, although I could probably put the starter in myself now...

Post by **Legacy777** » Thu Jan 09, 2003 6:24 pm

Mine don't click......or at least I have not heard a click....

entirelyturbo · Post by **entirelyturbo** » Thu Jan 09, 2003 8:24 pm

So you turn the key to Start, and you hear absolute silence? No click, nothing? You must have a bad wire somewhere...I hear you, you're sayin' "No sh!t

!"

magicmike · Post by **magicmike** » Thu Jan 09, 2003 8:38 pm

One thing to try is to see if 12 volts is leaving the key cylinder assembly. just drop the bottom half of the dash (the piece above your knees) and look for the main that goes to the key switch. there should be a plug there somewhere where you can stick a test light or multi meter and look for a wire that shows voltage only when you turn the key to the crank possition. It is possible that your key cylinder is worn. Hey if looking for an electrical problem, start from the source right? Good luck

Mike

Post by **Legacy777** » Fri Jan 10, 2003 4:17 pm

Thanks for the tip.

I talked with a buddy yesterday and he made a comment about he was surprised my car wasn't cutting out. But it got me thinking.....if it were ignition of some sorts I would probably have cutting out issues. I can't see just the "start" position be bad on the ignition switch and everything else be good....but anything is possible.

Someone also recommended checking the fusable link and such.

I think what the plan of attack is going to be is checking/cleaning all contact points, taking the battery out and taking resistance readings from the battery terminal connectors to the starter, to all the ground points from the terminal connectors, and to the fusable link, before and after the link.

Those are all relatively easy things to do and should help eliminate some possible causes.

entirelyturbo · Post by **entirelyturbo** » Fri Jan 10, 2003 5:01 pm

Legacy777 wrote:I can't see just the "start" position be bad on the ignition switch and everything else be good....but anything is possible.

Ignition switches are strange pieces of machinery. My first car, a Mazda 626, had a bad ignition switch, and I kid you not, the a/c and windshield wipers would not work at the same time... either one or the other...

Post by **Legacy777** » Fri Jan 10, 2003 10:01 pm

LOL that's funny.....I'll keep ya guys posted on what I find.

mile hi · Post by **mile hi** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 2:47 am

That is funny! Josh what can happen in the ignition switch is that the key part wears a bit and will not quite turn the switch part of the assembly far enough to contact the start terminal at times. As far as curing this by turning your lights on might have something to do with the AC and windsheild wiper type of problem and that is far above my ability. It even of makes my head hurt just thinking about it.
AL(CO)

Post by **Legacy777** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 2:52 am

hahaha......I'll let ya guys know what I find out later.

Post by **Legacy777** » Fri May 21, 2004 2:24 am

Well it happened again tonight. I was however in the garage, so had tools and such at my disposal.

I did notice that when I turned the key I did not hear any clicking noise, however the dash lights DID dim when I turned the key to the START position. So I would think it's not the ignition itself, because there's still an amperage draw that is dimming the lights.

I tried fiddling with things a little bit. Then took a hammer and whacked on the starter. It started right up after that. So either it was just pure coincidence that it started up after me whacking on it......or possibly the solenoid is sticking, or something.

I tested the wiring to the starter. It had voltage to it.....actually i tested the ground loop. Didn't test the pos. loop.

Thoughts?

entirelyturbo · Post by **entirelyturbo** » Fri May 21, 2004 2:43 am

Holy old-ass thread, Batman!

Your lights dimmed, so that means juice is getting to your starter. That rules out anything like an ignition switch, AT neutral safety switch, etc. etc.

Here is something I've pondered before though. The starter, when you turn it to Start, just shoots the spinning gear at the flywheel/flex plate, with no guarantee that it will actually engage. Yeah it always seems to, but probability dictates that sometime, the teeth will not match up, and the gear will either just run into the flywheel and just stop, or make nasty grinding noises until it meshes with it. I wonder, could it possibly have just been the starter randomly hitting the flex plate, not meshing, and just stopping, while still drawing juice? And then when you bonked it, turned the gear ever so slightly, enough for it to mesh? I doubt that's what happened, but this seems to happen very rarely and randomly, can't rule it out

Other than that, if ya got an extra $150 layin around, get a new starter, drop the beotch in. And if it doesn't solve the problem, look at it this way: You at least have a brand-new starter

Brat4by4 · Post by **Brat4by4** » Fri May 21, 2004 3:12 am

Ok, so you just rewired your car stereo, correct? Had you done anything to your stereo near the time this last did this? It's a long shot, but that is the last thing I know of that you did to your car... and it is electrical.

I second getting a new starter. That seems to be the only problem area, everything seems to be working fine. And check your photon barrier, one the main reflectors may have been knocked out of alignment

You can check recent posts on where to find it, it's in your trunk

eastbaysubaru · Post by **eastbaysubaru** » Fri May 21, 2004 4:27 am

I don't really have any positive information to add to this, but I have experienced something similar. It happens every once in a while and isn't a huge problem because the workaround is fairly easy in my case. I just shift the auto to neutral and it starts right up. It's been doing it for years now and I just haven't paid much attention to it as it's only about three or four times a year that it happens.

-Brian

vrg3 · Post by **vrg3** » Fri May 21, 2004 7:53 am

Legacy777 wrote:Then took a hammer and whacked on the starter. It started right up after that.

The hammer trick is usually the way to temporarily work around a stuck brush or solenoid, so I might suspect those... You may want to look into how much a local shop would charge to rebuild your starter. It might not be too much, and it could at worst give you some peace of mind. If you're lucky you might find a place that could do it for you while you wait.

Post by **Legacy777** » Fri May 21, 2004 2:15 pm

Thanks for the comments guys. I suspect like vrg3, that's it's a stuck brush or solenoid. The solenoid will make a clicking sound when it engages, and there was no clicking sound.

When I did put new contacts in I didn't necessarily do it the best because I had no garage...it was raining, and it was cold....

I will be needing a new starter when i do my MT swap....so I'm not going to worry about it. I'll probably get a reman starter when I do the swap for the piece of mind.

photon barrier....you smokin crack

eastbaysubaru · Post by **eastbaysubaru** » Fri May 21, 2004 4:30 pm

Just for kicks Josh, try putting the selector into neutral next time. I'm kinda curious if you're experiencing the same thing I am.

-Brian

Post by **Legacy777** » Fri May 21, 2004 5:52 pm

i've tried that, and almost anything I could think of in the past.....didn't work. If it happens again....I'll give it a shot

eastbaysubaru · Post by **eastbaysubaru** » Fri May 21, 2004 11:19 pm

Cool. The problem I have hasn't been detrimental, I think that's why I've never really brought it up before. Let me know if that works for you next time.

-Brian

Post by **Legacy777** » Sun Aug 29, 2004 10:07 pm

I'm updating this thread. I took apart the AT starter solenoid today just to look at it, and compare to the MT. The MT had very little wear compared to the AT.

I noticed on the AT that I didn't get the contacts completely square with the solenoid, so it was only hitting on one side. This doesn't surprise me, considering I changed the contacts in the rain & cold under a carport. It was not fun at all.

You can see some of the pics I took of the starters at the bottom of this page
http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8 ... legswap/12

Post by **Legacy777** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 1:04 am

Here's the place where you can order the contacts
http://4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTricks/Sta ... neOrdering

You want to order 2 of the Type A smaller contacts

Or you could probably just give your local toyota dealer the following part # 28226-72010 and 28226-72080 and get them. Not sure what costs would be

Lunatech · Post by **Lunatech** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 3:03 am

subyluvr2212 wrote:Holy old-ass thread, Batman! :lol:

So, is it cured?

Post by **Legacy777** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 3:25 pm

Yeah it's been cured.

I just updated the thread with current info on where to buy the contacts.

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Crazy starting issues

Crazy starting issues