Need struts!!

tonflo · Post by **tonflo** » Thu Sep 25, 2003 4:11 am

Hi all, new here & need advice. I have a '94 Legacy Turbo wagon (auto for whoever was doing the survey). My LF strut is blown. Do I do all 4 as a precaution or just fronts to save money? The cheapest I can find them is GR2s for $329/set of 4 or AGXs for $389/4. Or buy all 4 and sit on the rears until they go? Fronts only for $160 or $200( GR2 or AGX). Second, since the brake lines get unhooked for the struts, should I switch to stainless brake lines? If so, where's a good place to get them cheap & will the more popular Impreza/WRX ones fit right (both length & the fittings)? Third, the outer RF CV boot is starting to crack. Better to swap whole shaft for rebuilt or boot kit & repack? Assuming I go with the AGXs, how accessible are the adjustments, especially on the rears? Can I get at them from the top, the bottom, or the side? If the side, do you need to jack up the car or remove the wheel? Is the adjustment accessible throught the spokes? Also, my coolant tank is getting ready to blow up again (the black one the radiator cap screw on to). Is anyone aware of an aluminum replacement? The original made it to ~3 yrs ago & now this one is oozing all along the seam wher ethe top meeets the box. it's only a matter of time. I'm sick of $100 disposable parts. Any other repairs or upgrades I should consider while stuff is apart? Thank you for any advice.

mTk · Post by **mTk** » Thu Sep 25, 2003 4:38 am

Gr2s are $58 apiece at tirerack.com

pdm-racing.com for the brakelines (i've purchased almost all of my suspension from them)

If it isn't actually leaking, and the joint works fine, i'd just replace the boot, it's like $12 max

The agxs are adjustable in the front from a dial on the top of the strut. The rears ahve a dial on the lower portion. Yes you can adjust them w/o jacking up the car, taking off wheels, etc..

If you do a search, there are some recent posts about tank replacements

MK

mTk · Post by **mTk** » Thu Sep 25, 2003 4:39 am

You might also consider STI strut top mounts while you have everything out.

MK

tonflo · Post by **tonflo** » Thu Sep 25, 2003 4:51 am

Are the Sti strut mounts a drop in or does something need modification? What's their advantage? Do you know a part # or where to get the right thing? Thanks for such fast response & advice.

Post by **Legacy777** » Thu Sep 25, 2003 1:59 pm

replace all four struts at once....I did just the fronts and eventually the rears went out....but the car never handled worth a crap for that interium time. Once I put matching struts on front and rear, car handled like a dream. I have the GR2's.

The advantage of the sti top mounts is harder rubber, less flexing/squishing of the rubber. If you plan to get stiffer springs later, I'd probably just wait to get them until then. If you don't plan on getting into your suspension anytime soon again, I'd say go for them now. As for fitment, they are direct replacements for the stock units.

tonflo · Post by **tonflo** » Thu Sep 25, 2003 2:14 pm

Where can I get the Sti mounts? Are they expensive? I see on Tire Rack's site they have KYB ones for $58 each. Are these as good as Stis? Also, should I replace the rear mounts too & with what? Thanks guys.

tonflo · Post by **tonflo** » Thu Sep 25, 2003 6:18 pm

Should I do stiffer springs at the same time? Will the car still be able to be aligned or would I need camber bolts? Any recommendations for springs & part #? This stuff is adding up fast.

ciper · Post by **ciper** » Thu Sep 25, 2003 7:35 pm

Whats your budget?

I suggest doing as much as possible at the same time, because its a real pain in the behind to take it all apart again. Also once its all in place you can get a performance alignment and the car will really shine.

tonflo · Post by **tonflo** » Thu Sep 25, 2003 10:04 pm

Budget is limited but I consider it to be an investment in good handling & 8 more yrs before it needs work. Here's what I figure: stainless brake lines $100, speedbleeders $20, 4 GR2s $232, CV boots & grease ~$30, aluminum coolant tank $135, alignment ~$60. Thats $587 before possible springs. Figure ~$200 for springs? That's $787 before labor which I'm guessing ~$400-500. So $1200-$1300 total. Definitely not cheap but cheaper than 2-3 Sti pymts or an NSX. Any recommendations for particular vendors or part #s appreciated. What do you consider performance alignment specs? I don't want to buy tires yearly from neg. camber.

Post by **Legacy777** » Thu Sep 25, 2003 10:57 pm

you can get sti top mounts from www.z1auto.com I got mine for 45 a piece.

Depending on the springs you go for, you most likely will not need camber bolts. I like my whitelines, they're not too harsh, and the ride is not too low.

Alignment specs....if you drive semi-agressively, run -1.0 camber all the way around. If you autox or want some rotation/oversteer, you can throw some toe out in the rear as well. The car just becomes more twitchy.

eastbaysubaru · Post by **eastbaysubaru** » Thu Sep 25, 2003 11:50 pm

Do the labor yourself and save the ~$400 - $500. It's really pretty easy.

-Brian

mTk · Post by **mTk** » Fri Sep 26, 2003 2:42 am

If you get struts, mounts and springs, it'll be REALLY REALLY easy, since you can have it all assembled before you actually do the install.

MK

tonflo · Post by **tonflo** » Fri Sep 26, 2003 3:06 am

Thank you all for the advice. I think this is beyond one man with a floor jack in a small garage. My concerns are not being able to get the half shaft out without an impact (been there before), damaging something trying to get it apart, and putting something in wrong that ends up causing more damage & costing even more than what I would've paid somebody to do it in the 1st place. I think with a lift, airtools, and someone experienced watching me I could do it, but as is it's will take 5x longer & probably not turn out so good. Which springs??? Apparently the wagons used 2 types of tapered springs & you can't tell until it's apart which ones you have. This means no car for many days waiting for them to arrive.Or you have to switch strut mounts & use some other spring. Any one want to play Shell answer man? Please advise some more.

Post by **Legacy777** » Fri Sep 26, 2003 3:12 am

you have non-tapered springs.....or you should. The tapered springs came mainly on the 90-91 models

You can jack up the rear end and look at the springs. If the diameter at the top is nearly the same as the bottom, then you don't have tapered springs.

Here's some pics of the tapered springs

http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8 ... pring1.jpg
http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8 ... pring2.jpg
http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8 ... pring3.jpg
http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8 ... pring4.jpg
http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8 ... pring5.jpg

tonflo · Post by **tonflo** » Fri Sep 26, 2003 9:05 am

Thanks for the pics Josh. Are those the Whitelines? That looks like a big drop- still alignable? How's the ride? The 1st pic shows new strut mounts, are those the Sti ones or just new wagon ones? They look different than the ones on Z1auto's site for the Sti which are $235/set of 4(expensive rubber). Will all 4 fit my car or just the fronts? Good advice all- if I got spring struts & mounts & assembled ahead of time are the marks for aligning the springs in the perches obvious since I wouldn't be looking at the old ones as a comparison? The big nut on top would still need final tightening once car is together & back on ground right? If I don't have tapered (only the rears do that?), which Legacy springs are correct?

Post by **Legacy777** » Fri Sep 26, 2003 2:40 pm

Yes, they are whitelines.

Drop was only around 1-1.25" The car aligned fine. I am running -1 degree of camber all the way around. Ride is pretty decent for lowering springs. It can be harsh on certain roads, but I've gotten used to it.

Those are sti strut top mounts. The ones on the left are the front and will the same for pretty much all the legacies & imprezas up until 2002 for sure. The rear springs are tapered, so the rear top mounts are different.

Call them for a price. Tell him the guys at the legacycentral board sent you. Like I said....I paid $45 a piece for my sti mounts. You can get the correct top mounts for your car, and they will fit.

You really will need to take out the old springs/struts before you can assemble the new ones. You need some of the little rubber sleeves dust boots (really should get new ones) and other misc hardware. Not to mention the top spring keepers you'll need from the old ones.

You can tighten the top nut with them off the car. You just need the right tools to keep the shaft from turning.

ciper · Post by **ciper** » Fri Sep 26, 2003 9:17 pm

An impact wrench can get the stut top night tight enough to use a torque wrench on once the car is on the ground.

I havent heard of many people with alignment problems when lowering subarus, even with drastic drops. Remember that our cars have quite a bit of suspension travel, a 1 inch drop is nothing.

I got my STI tops for just under 200. The place still has them for 200 shipped. Im also using the whiteline springs. When I had the GR-2 the ride was great, not uncorfortable. Now with the AGX and other suspension items my ride is very firm.

tonflo · Post by **tonflo** » Sat Sep 27, 2003 1:28 am

Josh, are you saying the 2 mounts on the right are Sti or wagon ones? Or just call z1 &v tell them what I have & what I want to do? The 2 right springs are obviously tapered so is there any easy way to tell which tapered rears I would need? Whiteline list 2 diff. part #s on pdm-racing's site for Legacies of that period. I just want to get the right parts if I do this so it's done in 1 day & gets aligned that day. It seems like with the degree of guess work it might be safer to reuse the stock springs & mounts.

Post by **Legacy777** » Sat Sep 27, 2003 1:55 am

there is no guess work. It is pretty cut and dry.

The tapered springs came on the early (90-91, and some 92 models) You most likely do NOT have tapered springs. All you have to do is jack the thing up and look. It is obvious.

The right two mounts are STI MOUNTS. they just happen to be for the tapered springs.

Whiteline offers two sets of rear springs, tapered & non-tapered.

Direct from whiteline

[WR] Whiteline have the following springs available for Subaru Liberty, 90 FWD
Control front - part# 74502
Control rear - part# 70368 *

(*) - Check top and bottom I.D. of the original spring.
If top I.D.=125mm and bottom I.D.=141mm then use part# 70369.
If top I.D.=95mm and bottom I.D.=138 then use part# 70368.

search is also your friend too

viewtopic.php?t=1128&highlight=whiteline+70369

ciper · Post by **ciper** » Sat Sep 27, 2003 2:34 am

My car had tapered springs and I converted it to standard springs. I also used the 93+ Impreza mounts becuase they are cheap and easy to find.

I suggest that if you have the tapered just switch over, then you can get the right spring rate especially if you have a wagon. The tapered springs from whiteline are designed for FWD sedans so the rate is lower than the rest.

tonflo · Post by **tonflo** » Sat Sep 27, 2003 7:39 am

Josh, I will jack it up today to check. What is Whiteline's part # for a '94 turbo wagon? If I don't have tapered, can I just reuse my mounts with the new springs? Thank you.

tonflo · Post by **tonflo** » Sat Sep 27, 2003 8:26 am

Just emailed whiteline for help. Josh, if I don't have tapered than what springs would I need & are the Sti rear mounts (the skinny ones in your pic) going to fit nontapered? it doesn't look it. The 74502 you list is their flatout spring which is probably too low for around here and I worry about alignment. For control springs the listings on pdm's site is 70198 frt of wagon or wagon RS turbo (is that my car?). For rears it can be 70369 or 68 depending on diam. Josh, if you are correct & mine aren't tapered (I'll be jacking today) then what #? ciper, if you just changed mounts & standard springs, what part # did you use for standard? Will the Sti mounts fit whichever set of springs or do I need a particular size & if so what is the #? How do i know if I'm BC, BF or whatever? I'm sorry to keep asking stuff, but this isn't easy to figure out & I can't afford the time & money of shipping & returning incorrect parts & being carless waiting for the right ones & paying to reassemble the car once & ripping it all apart to fix right again 5 days later.

Post by **Legacy777** » Sat Sep 27, 2003 4:34 pm

they make sti mounts for the non-tapered mounts.....they're the same ones that the impreza uses that ciper mentioned.

if you have non-tapered use this spring 70369

tonflo · Post by **tonflo** » Sat Sep 27, 2003 7:03 pm

Josh & ciper- took your advice & jacked it up. As best I can measure with them in the car getting as close as I can to the btm & top coils the btm is 5.5 in. & the top is 5 in. This works out to 139.7mm btm & 127mm top. The 2 Whiteline sets are 70369 (141/125mm) or 70368 (138/95mm) Since my measurement isn't perfect it looks like I need the 69s since 95mm is 3.74 inches & there's no way they're that skinny at the top or that I'm 1.25 inches off measuring. The taper is really slight, you can't pick it up well by eye. So what size/part# Sti mounts to you recommend? Are the Sti ones only in 1 size & that fits all? I'm assuming the fronts are universal & the rears need to be correct for the car & springs.
While it was up I followed advice elsewhere on this site & pulled the plastic guard off the fuel filler neck. A ton of sand fell out. There is some surface rust & pitting, but nothing major. I cut a whole in the guard big enough to stick the hose nozzle in for a good blast whenever I wash the car. Thank you both for your help.

Post by **Legacy777** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 2:40 pm

The front sti strut top mounts are universal. The rears, I don't know the part #, but you can just get the ones for the 93-2001 impreza, and they'll work

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A forum for 89-94 BC-BF(BJ) Legacy Owners and Fans

Need struts!!

Need struts!!

jacked it up & measured