Need electronics help, PFC into Ej22t

PhyrraM · Post by **PhyrraM** » Thu Apr 17, 2008 4:37 am

SemperGuard was right. If you join the channels from 4 down to 2 AFTER the ignitor it works. Remember to ground your new ignitor.

Some wiring diagrams for the EJ20G are wrong. You need to bond ECU pins 7&9 and pins 8&10, again after the ignitor. After that simple mod it was plug and play.

I mounted a 6 channel SVX ignitor near the ECU in the cabin. The ECU feeds the new ignitor. Two EJ22 ingnitors will also work, as will a 4 channels EJ20G ignitor. You need to access the largest of the 4 ECU connectors. I believe it's 22 pins and on the top. You are looking for pins 7, 8, 9 and 10. Pin 9 and 10 will have wires in them, pins 7 and 8 will be empty. I added the 2 missing pins from wires sourced from a spare harness. Run these in order to the ignitors. Pin 7>channel one, pin 8> channel two, Etc.... Four and six channel ignitors are labeled even.

The outputs from the ignitor need to be fed to the harness. Channel 1&3 go to the wire that used to be ECU pin 9. Channels 2 &4 go to the wire that was ECU pin 10. The black wire on the ignitor/s needs to be grounded.

Your done in side the car.

I gutted a factory Ej22t ignitor and essentially made it a bypass box. No electronics in it what-so-ever. This is really just a reversable way to remove the stock ignitor. It is no longer needed as the one mounted in the cabin now runs the engine.

Changed out the ECU and turned the key. Fired right up. It took a minute for the EJ20G ECU to learn how to idle the car. Also the check engine light was on. I believe it's not seeing the air temp sensor. Drivability was just the same as stock. Power seemed about the same up until about 50-60% throttle. The ECU stopped the fun at that RPM. It was kinda like a rev limiter. I believe it's related to the check engine light. As soon as you backed off the throttle a little bit everything was normal. It happened in every gear at any speed and seemed totally dependant on the throttle. Nothing else that I could ascertain.

Either way, total success. A 4 channel ECU can run a wasted spark engine with almost no mods. With a "install kit" this could be considered plug and play.

The Power FC was next. At this point it was a simple as swapping the ECU. The PFC fired right up also. It took a while to learn the idle, but this is normal for a PFC. Drove the car around the block after about 5 minutes of idle learning. It was able to go to Redline no problem. This comfirmed to me that the previous problem was indeed related to the check engine light and not the ignition.

I'll have pictures up tonight or tomorrow. Going to go for a drive right now. I don't have a wideband installed ATM, so I guess I need to be carefull.

Post by **Legacy777** » Fri Apr 18, 2008 12:04 am

What year EJ20G ECU did you use? I don't believe they had air temp sensors.

Any idea if the dwell is being affected?

PhyrraM · Post by **PhyrraM** » Fri Apr 18, 2008 1:52 am

This is it:

All I know about it is what is stated in the picture.

The Power FC is showing a check engine light also, so there must be a mismatch in one sensor or another. Maybe the pressure sensor as that reading never changes when datalogging the PFC. I'm guessing if I can fix it with the PFC installed, I will also fix the EJ20G ECU.

No indication at all the dwell is off. Never misses and pulls smooth and strong. It even lugs down low, just like stock.

Post by **Legacy777** » Fri Apr 18, 2008 6:30 pm

Have you checked the code to see what it is?

PhyrraM · Post by **PhyrraM** » Fri Apr 18, 2008 9:55 pm

Not yet. Been busy with escrow related stuff. Seeing as the harness are known to be basically the same, I'm thinking that the reason for the check engine light will be something simple. Possibly a bad connection in my adaptor harness. I also want to install my wideband O2 before I accidentally damage the motor. I'm going to pull the PFC for the Rallycross because I won't be listening for knock when racing.

The way I wired it in should work for any of the "plug and play" EJ20G ECUs. You seem to have steered away from the PFC, but the procedure will work for any of the others.

I will also comment on how well it drives. Even the basemap in the PFC, with no changes, runs the car very well. There is a bit of mid-range detonation. A small ping, if you will. But seeing as it's the 'wrong' ECU, running the 'wrong' engine, using the 'wrong' gas and not even one bit of tuning yet, it's amazingly drivable. Once rolling it feels stock, but it does have a tendancy to die when returning to idle as your coming to a stop. It does seem to be learning how to deal with that, as it gets a tiny bit better every time. Now after the second full day, it does this much less than in the first few hours. Also, I DID NOT follow the initial idle learning procedure. I just plugged it in, did a master reset, and started it up.

I will report back as soon as I figure out what is keeping the CEL on.

farfrumwork · Post by **farfrumwork** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 12:03 am

Nice work man!

Please keep us informed of developments, and CE codes it is throwing.

Maybe I'll be getting some EM before I thought!

Thanks again
-Chad

James614 · Post by **James614** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 12:45 am

I see some PFCs on e-Bay going for $900. Cheaper than other solutions, and certainly easier to install, but holy crap I guess my dream of a 150 standalone solution is........ a dream.

Oh well, at least this setup is easily attainable with my skillset and budget (let the saving being!)

keirnna · Post by **keirnna** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 12:47 am

I can find you a power FC for an EJ20G for under $500 most of the time.

PhyrraM · Post by **PhyrraM** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 1:40 am

keirnna wrote:I can find you a power FC for an EJ20G for under $500 most of the time.

Get me one.

PM me please.

Arctic Assassian · Post by **Arctic Assassian** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 3:08 am

Oh god awesome. Do you know where I can find a powerFC?

James614 · Post by **James614** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 4:02 am

Under $500 = suh-weet! Too bad my motor still needs quite a few supporting mods before I can think about this, and my procrastinitis has made it difficult to get things done. But someday soon...... someday soon..... I'll show those 5.0 Mustangs how it's done.

keirnna · Post by **keirnna** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 4:33 am

As I find them I will let you know. My friend will be parting out his car with a Power FC and no commander very soon. He also has a VF22 with a 90* inlet.

asc_up · Post by **asc_up** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 6:07 am

keirnna wrote:He also has a VF22 with a 90* inlet.

ME WANT!!

Haha.

keirnna · Post by **keirnna** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 6:21 am

asc_up wrote:
keirnna wrote:He also has a VF22 with a 90* inlet.
ME WANT!!

Haha.

Make him an offer. My friend just found out he has to leave Japan in less than a month and he needs to part this car out quickly to have enough cash to buy a car in the states. The turbo is in great shape. It has the 90* inlet welded on it. I can try to take some pictures of it installed later today.

PhyrraM · Post by **PhyrraM** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 6:52 pm

Update:

Check engine light is out! Turns out that the EG20G boost sensor shares it's ground with the water temp sensor. The EJ22T boost sensor has it's own ground. The solution was to remove pin 5 on B48 and join it with pin 21 on B48. This could easily be done with a conversion harness to make it non-destructive and plug and play.

I also got my wideband and DataLogit installed. Just need to run home and get the laptop. Might actually do some tuning today.

Also, 3 days and a tank of gas in.....no apparent ignition, spark or dwell related problems. Only problems have been related to wiring or tuning. Even the wiring was extremely minor compared to a full standalone.

If there truely is a supply of $400-$600 PFCs out there, this is prolly the best bang-for-the-buck engine management out there for the SS and TW.

Arctic Assassian · Post by **Arctic Assassian** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 9:13 pm

The cheapest I can find is $650.

PhyrraM · Post by **PhyrraM** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 9:38 pm

Arctic Assassian wrote:The cheapest I can find is $650.

yeah, refering to Kiernna's statement tht he can get them. He's in Japan, so se'll see. $650-$800 is what I find also. Plus you need either the commander or (preferably) DataLogit to actually program it yourself.

My setup total is (collected over the span of about a year):

$750+$80 shipping from UK for the PFC and the Commander.
$399+~$30 shipping for the DataLogit
$199+$0 shipping for the PLX wideband.
$287+$40 shipping for the Ebay Dell Lattitude 630 notebook.
$35 to the junkyard for a donor ECU and harness connectors to build the conversion harness to keep me from snipping any wires.

If you assume the wideband and the notebook are constants in any ECU upgrade, your still a bit less than other standalones.

Hopefully my experiance will help others with thier own pro-and-con list. It may not be the most powerfull or fully featured ECU, but the commander can satisfy your techno-fix or possibly even save the motor when you don't have your laptop. Datalogit is very nice for an intergrated tuning enviroment. The Wideband readings are already in the logs, unlike some others where you need to run 2 logs and cross reference them.

Arctic Assassian · Post by **Arctic Assassian** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 9:53 pm

as far as tuning goes, I could get by with the commander and wideband correct? What do you need the laptop for?

PhyrraM · Post by **PhyrraM** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 10:31 pm

The commander and wideband alone will only allow you to tune in 'realtime'. You will need to watch the wideband, RPM, knock display and the mapwatch (to know what cell to tune) all at the same time.....in addition to THE ROAD! Remember these logging runs are ideally 2000 rpm to redline sprints in a higher gear. Usually 3rd gear. First and second gear usually go by too fast to get good samples. Fourth and fifth take you to dangerous speeds near redline.

The laptop and DataLogit will allow you to record the data while you concentrate on only the road. Then you can go back and analyze the data in a safe spot to make changes.

Both can get the job done, however. One has significantly more hazards associated with it.

keirnna · Post by **keirnna** » Sun Apr 20, 2008 12:14 am

Arctic Assassian wrote:The cheapest I can find is $650.

Unfortuantley the EJ20G Power FC is out of production and they are becoming rather hard to find. If you wanted a EJ207 or EJ20K one they are easy to find. I know where two 20K PFCs are for $500 and a EJ207 one is for $600. Like I said I will keep my eyes open. I was just told that a EJ20G Power FC sold for almost $900 on eBay.

keirnna · Post by **keirnna** » Sun Apr 20, 2008 12:18 am

PhyrraM wrote:The commander and wideband alone will only allow you to tune in 'realtime'. You will need to watch the wideband, RPM, knock display and the mapwatch (to know what cell to tune) all at the same time.....in addition to THE ROAD! Remember these logging runs are ideally 2000 rpm to redline sprints in a higher gear. Usually 3rd gear. First and second gear usually go by too fast to get good samples. Fourth and fifth take you to dangerous speeds near redline.

The laptop and DataLogit will allow you to record the data while you concentrate on only the road. Then you can go back and analyze the data in a safe spot to make changes.

Both can get the job done, however. One has significantly more hazards associated with it.

If using the 'Map Tracer' function on the Power FC the right d-pad button will cycle through a holding history map tracer. There are a few other options too. With that you can do a pull and if you have too much knock the CEL will flash. Once you have the pull take a picture of the traced map and then go to the corresponding fuel and ign cells to make changes. It is a giant pain in the ass to do without a datalogit or Apex'i software.

Arctic Assassian · Post by **Arctic Assassian** » Sun Apr 20, 2008 1:48 am

well the 650 one comes with the commander and datalogit. Will the datalogit take an input from a wideband, like say the uego?

keirnna · Post by **keirnna** » Sun Apr 20, 2008 1:51 am

Yes it takes input from any 0-5 volt 5 wire wideband. Which version of datalogit is it? For $650 you got a PFC, Datalogit, Commander, and boost control kit? Holy fuck that is an awesome deal.

keirnna · Post by **keirnna** » Sun Apr 20, 2008 2:24 am

Also if you now have an EJ20G plug and play ECU harness you could look at the Hydra as they make one for the EJ20G Impreza I believe.

SemperGuard · Post by **SemperGuard** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 8:11 am

PhyrraM wrote:Basically, SemperGuard was right.

Of course I was right

.

I don't think that dwell is an issue. If you look at it from a stock wastespark setup point-of-view you have two coils. With firing order 1-3-2-4, front-back-front-back, no issues with dwell in stock form. If you change it to use 4 ignitors but still only two coils you can't have any more of an issue with dwell than you would've already started with right?

So you only got a code 44? You didn't get a code 24, or 49? Or did you change the MAFS with the ECM?

The dieing at idle is something I've been trying to figure out also, but I think it's related to my code 24, which sounds like something isolated to my engine since you're not getting it also. Are you still using the stock 370cc injectors? That's probably your ping/det. Throw on some 440's, a vf10,8,12 or 16g and you'll be loving it.

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Need electronics help, PFC into Ej22t