Q: Does the Air/Water I/C from the good versions of the legacy turbo have a spot for a BOV?
A: yes
Q: what amount of boost can you put through that unit?
A: any amount you want, you have to decide what pressure drop you can live with, as boost goes up, so do pressure losses (essentially same as WRX air-to-air)
Q: restrictions over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
A: more costly, more complex installation, more to go wrong, (active components rather than passive), not good for extended boost applications, harder to find (only made for early 90's Turbo Legacy, Subaru must think the air-to-air is as good or better)
Q: advantages over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
A: for short boost applications, marginally better for street and strip, not so good for track, can be used to supercool for short periods, looks snazzier
Larry Witherspoon
Torrance (Los Angeles)
ssspoon@aol.com
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Air Water I/C BOV and A/A vs A/W
Moderators: Helpinators, Moderators
-
dfullerton.screaming.net
Air Water I/C BOV and A/A vs A/W
Cost has a big part to play in this It must be cheaper to build air to air.
----- Original Message -----
From: ssspoon@aol.com
To: BC-BFLegacyWorks@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 5:16 PM
Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Air Water I/C BOV and A/A vs A/W
Q: Does the Air/Water I/C from the good versions of the legacy turbo have a spot for a BOV?
A: yes
Q: what amount of boost can you put through that unit?
A: any amount you want, you have to decide what pressure drop you can live with, as boost goes up, so do pressure losses (essentially same as WRX air-to-air)
Q: restrictions over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
A: more costly, more complex installation, more to go wrong, (active components rather than passive), not good for extended boost applications, harder to find (only made for early 90's Turbo Legacy, Subaru must think the air-to-air is as good or better)
Q: advantages over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
A: for short boost applications, marginally better for street and strip, not so good for track, can be used to supercool for short periods, looks snazzier
Larry Witherspoon
Torrance (Los Angeles)
ssspoon@aol.com
To unsubscribe from this group, please send an email to:
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----- Original Message -----
From: ssspoon@aol.com
To: BC-BFLegacyWorks@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 5:16 PM
Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Air Water I/C BOV and A/A vs A/W
Q: Does the Air/Water I/C from the good versions of the legacy turbo have a spot for a BOV?
A: yes
Q: what amount of boost can you put through that unit?
A: any amount you want, you have to decide what pressure drop you can live with, as boost goes up, so do pressure losses (essentially same as WRX air-to-air)
Q: restrictions over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
A: more costly, more complex installation, more to go wrong, (active components rather than passive), not good for extended boost applications, harder to find (only made for early 90's Turbo Legacy, Subaru must think the air-to-air is as good or better)
Q: advantages over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
A: for short boost applications, marginally better for street and strip, not so good for track, can be used to supercool for short periods, looks snazzier
Larry Witherspoon
Torrance (Los Angeles)
ssspoon@aol.com
To unsubscribe from this group, please send an email to:
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-
subbyrs91
Air Water I/C BOV and A/A vs A/W
Why is it not good for extended boost applications? Water's heat
transfer ability is several times better than air....AFAIK Subaru
changed to air/air for the Impreza because of lower cost & less
complexity....
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., ssspoon@a... wrote:
> Q: Does the Air/Water I/C from the good versions of the legacy
turbo have a
> spot for a BOV?
> A: yes
>
> Q: what amount of boost can you put through that unit?
> A: any amount you want, you have to decide what pressure drop you
can live
> with, as boost goes up, so do pressure losses (essentially same as
WRX
> air-to-air)
>
> Q: restrictions over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
> A: more costly, more complex installation, more to go wrong,
(active
> components rather than passive), not good for extended boost
applications,
> harder to find (only made for early 90's Turbo Legacy, Subaru must
think the
> air-to-air is as good or better)
>
> Q: advantages over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
> A: for short boost applications, marginally better for street and
strip, not
> so good for track, can be used to supercool for short periods,
looks snazzier
>
>
> Larry Witherspoon
> Torrance (Los Angeles)
> ssspoon@a...
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transfer ability is several times better than air....AFAIK Subaru
changed to air/air for the Impreza because of lower cost & less
complexity....
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., ssspoon@a... wrote:
> Q: Does the Air/Water I/C from the good versions of the legacy
turbo have a
> spot for a BOV?
> A: yes
>
> Q: what amount of boost can you put through that unit?
> A: any amount you want, you have to decide what pressure drop you
can live
> with, as boost goes up, so do pressure losses (essentially same as
WRX
> air-to-air)
>
> Q: restrictions over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
> A: more costly, more complex installation, more to go wrong,
(active
> components rather than passive), not good for extended boost
applications,
> harder to find (only made for early 90's Turbo Legacy, Subaru must
think the
> air-to-air is as good or better)
>
> Q: advantages over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
> A: for short boost applications, marginally better for street and
strip, not
> so good for track, can be used to supercool for short periods,
looks snazzier
>
>
> Larry Witherspoon
> Torrance (Los Angeles)
> ssspoon@a...
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-
legacycentral
Air Water I/C BOV and A/A vs A/W
I've read that A/W is bad for extended boost apps because while
water loves to soak heat, it doesn't give it up very fast. It reaches
a heat soak level and it takes a LOT of cooling to get the water
cold again. It's soak temp is high as well, so when it is soaked,
it's benefits disappear.
Dave
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "subbyrs91" <rob.haylock@x>
wrote:
> Why is it not good for extended boost applications? Water's
heat
> transfer ability is several times better than air....AFAIK Subaru
> changed to air/air for the Impreza because of lower cost & less
> complexity....
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water loves to soak heat, it doesn't give it up very fast. It reaches
a heat soak level and it takes a LOT of cooling to get the water
cold again. It's soak temp is high as well, so when it is soaked,
it's benefits disappear.
Dave
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "subbyrs91" <rob.haylock@x>
wrote:
> Why is it not good for extended boost applications? Water's
heat
> transfer ability is several times better than air....AFAIK Subaru
> changed to air/air for the Impreza because of lower cost & less
> complexity....
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-
rodeddy
Air Water I/C BOV and A/A vs A/W
The air/water ic is far more efficient than the air to air. The main
reason for change to air/air is the cost factor.
With the air /air there is but the intercooler.
With air/water there is intercooler unit/ front radiator / pump/
hoses / brkts / electrical components,etc, etc. There are diagrams on
the Legacy Central web page.
With the coservitive boost pressure most std subaru's run the std
air/air is fine. I know of a guy who used to do track work with his
RS Liberty and on constant boost there was no heat soak at all...
though you do need a larger front ic radiator from mrt... with the
std ic radiator heat soak eventually set in... This is on the track
though. On the road you would not get this constant boost situation.
During the summer months, for eg. whilst stopped at traffic lights i
switch the a/c on, this actually helps cool the air/water ic radiator
as the a/c fans are running. In the air/air ic massive heat soak is
happening during this idling period.
As for boost ...heaps. My std boost is 17psi...even in our hot
Australian summers... i do have the larger mrt front radiator though.
As for ease of fitting.... the air'air is way in front. The
air /water has heaps of parts, not to mention the electricals for the
pump... also the std RS pump has 2 speeds. Once you go passed 3/4
throttle the pumps goes into high range. If i was to fit an ic to a
car that does not have one, for ease go with the air to air, perhaps
a larger air /air,from mrt or such, rather than a std one. check out
there website on all this info... www.mrtrally.com.au It has info
on all this stuff.
hope this helps.
Cheers, Rod ..in OZ
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "subbyrs91" <rob.haylock@x> wrote:
> Why is it not good for extended boost applications? Water's heat
> transfer ability is several times better than air....AFAIK Subaru
> changed to air/air for the Impreza because of lower cost & less
> complexity....
>
>
> --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., ssspoon@a... wrote:
> > Q: Does the Air/Water I/C from the good versions of the legacy
> turbo have a
> > spot for a BOV?
> > A: yes
> >
> > Q: what amount of boost can you put through that unit?
> > A: any amount you want, you have to decide what pressure drop you
> can live
> > with, as boost goes up, so do pressure losses (essentially same
as
> WRX
> > air-to-air)
> >
> > Q: restrictions over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
> > A: more costly, more complex installation, more to go wrong,
> (active
> > components rather than passive), not good for extended boost
> applications,
> > harder to find (only made for early 90's Turbo Legacy, Subaru
must
> think the
> > air-to-air is as good or better)
> >
> > Q: advantages over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
> > A: for short boost applications, marginally better for street and
> strip, not
> > so good for track, can be used to supercool for short periods,
> looks snazzier
> >
> >
> > Larry Witherspoon
> > Torrance (Los Angeles)
> > ssspoon@a...
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reason for change to air/air is the cost factor.
With the air /air there is but the intercooler.
With air/water there is intercooler unit/ front radiator / pump/
hoses / brkts / electrical components,etc, etc. There are diagrams on
the Legacy Central web page.
With the coservitive boost pressure most std subaru's run the std
air/air is fine. I know of a guy who used to do track work with his
RS Liberty and on constant boost there was no heat soak at all...
though you do need a larger front ic radiator from mrt... with the
std ic radiator heat soak eventually set in... This is on the track
though. On the road you would not get this constant boost situation.
During the summer months, for eg. whilst stopped at traffic lights i
switch the a/c on, this actually helps cool the air/water ic radiator
as the a/c fans are running. In the air/air ic massive heat soak is
happening during this idling period.
As for boost ...heaps. My std boost is 17psi...even in our hot
Australian summers... i do have the larger mrt front radiator though.
As for ease of fitting.... the air'air is way in front. The
air /water has heaps of parts, not to mention the electricals for the
pump... also the std RS pump has 2 speeds. Once you go passed 3/4
throttle the pumps goes into high range. If i was to fit an ic to a
car that does not have one, for ease go with the air to air, perhaps
a larger air /air,from mrt or such, rather than a std one. check out
there website on all this info... www.mrtrally.com.au It has info
on all this stuff.
hope this helps.
Cheers, Rod ..in OZ
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "subbyrs91" <rob.haylock@x> wrote:
> Why is it not good for extended boost applications? Water's heat
> transfer ability is several times better than air....AFAIK Subaru
> changed to air/air for the Impreza because of lower cost & less
> complexity....
>
>
> --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., ssspoon@a... wrote:
> > Q: Does the Air/Water I/C from the good versions of the legacy
> turbo have a
> > spot for a BOV?
> > A: yes
> >
> > Q: what amount of boost can you put through that unit?
> > A: any amount you want, you have to decide what pressure drop you
> can live
> > with, as boost goes up, so do pressure losses (essentially same
as
> WRX
> > air-to-air)
> >
> > Q: restrictions over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
> > A: more costly, more complex installation, more to go wrong,
> (active
> > components rather than passive), not good for extended boost
> applications,
> > harder to find (only made for early 90's Turbo Legacy, Subaru
must
> think the
> > air-to-air is as good or better)
> >
> > Q: advantages over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
> > A: for short boost applications, marginally better for street and
> strip, not
> > so good for track, can be used to supercool for short periods,
> looks snazzier
> >
> >
> > Larry Witherspoon
> > Torrance (Los Angeles)
> > ssspoon@a...
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-
Josh Colombo
Air Water I/C BOV and A/A vs A/W
To my knowledge, the reason it is not good for extended boost applications is due to the flow rate capability of the pump. It can not circulate the water fast enough through the system to keep the temp down. However I would assume if you uprate the pump, or put a dual stage pump that is dependant on throttle position it could uprate the pump's speed for extended boosting.
josh
************************************
Josh Colombo
Josh@surrealmirage.com <mailto:Josh@surrealmirage.com> **NEW**
"Life, an ever-changing melody
of beats and rhythm" - ME
************************************
-----Original Message-----
From: subbyrs91 [mailto:rob.haylock@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 6:42 PM
To: BC-BFLegacyWorks@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: Air Water I/C BOV and A/A vs A/W
Why is it not good for extended boost applications? Water's heat
transfer ability is several times better than air....AFAIK Subaru
changed to air/air for the Impreza because of lower cost & less
complexity....
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., ssspoon@a... wrote:
> Q: Does the Air/Water I/C from the good versions of the legacy
turbo have a
> spot for a BOV?
> A: yes
>
> Q: what amount of boost can you put through that unit?
> A: any amount you want, you have to decide what pressure drop you
can live
> with, as boost goes up, so do pressure losses (essentially same as
WRX
> air-to-air)
>
> Q: restrictions over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
> A: more costly, more complex installation, more to go wrong,
(active
> components rather than passive), not good for extended boost
applications,
> harder to find (only made for early 90's Turbo Legacy, Subaru must
think the
> air-to-air is as good or better)
>
> Q: advantages over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
> A: for short boost applications, marginally better for street and
strip, not
> so good for track, can be used to supercool for short periods,
looks snazzier
>
>
> Larry Witherspoon
> Torrance (Los Angeles)
> ssspoon@a...
To unsubscribe from this group, please send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
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josh
************************************
Josh Colombo
Josh@surrealmirage.com <mailto:Josh@surrealmirage.com> **NEW**
"Life, an ever-changing melody
of beats and rhythm" - ME
************************************
-----Original Message-----
From: subbyrs91 [mailto:rob.haylock@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 6:42 PM
To: BC-BFLegacyWorks@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: Air Water I/C BOV and A/A vs A/W
Why is it not good for extended boost applications? Water's heat
transfer ability is several times better than air....AFAIK Subaru
changed to air/air for the Impreza because of lower cost & less
complexity....
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., ssspoon@a... wrote:
> Q: Does the Air/Water I/C from the good versions of the legacy
turbo have a
> spot for a BOV?
> A: yes
>
> Q: what amount of boost can you put through that unit?
> A: any amount you want, you have to decide what pressure drop you
can live
> with, as boost goes up, so do pressure losses (essentially same as
WRX
> air-to-air)
>
> Q: restrictions over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
> A: more costly, more complex installation, more to go wrong,
(active
> components rather than passive), not good for extended boost
applications,
> harder to find (only made for early 90's Turbo Legacy, Subaru must
think the
> air-to-air is as good or better)
>
> Q: advantages over a top mount air/air from the new WRX
> A: for short boost applications, marginally better for street and
strip, not
> so good for track, can be used to supercool for short periods,
looks snazzier
>
>
> Larry Witherspoon
> Torrance (Los Angeles)
> ssspoon@a...
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BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
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