Do you think subaru will try another svx-esque car?

THAWA · Post by **THAWA** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 12:17 am

Most the articles about the svx say it didn't sell well because it wasn't really something expected from subaru, they used to be econoboxes or was the image of them, then they made the svx and higher class machine. But now with the success of the WRX and STi and I'm sure the newer leg turbo do you think they'll try it again with a car like the svx or do you think they'll stick with the imp, leg, for, and baja? Coupe, power, odd styling, right up some peoples alleys, mine in particular.

FG!! · Post by **FG!!** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 12:42 am

It's almost certain that they will.

The B9 Scrambler showed in Tokyo and is rumoured be coming to NAIAS. If something doesn't come out of it, I'd be surprised.

legacy92ej22t · Post by **legacy92ej22t** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 1:03 am

Something like the B11 might come too. With the recent popularity of performance Subarus I wouldn't be at all suprised if they do something out of the ordinary.

I think the Baja is going down in flames though.

evolutionmovement · Post by **evolutionmovement** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 1:27 am

I see the practicality of four doors and the market bla bla bala, but I think the Baja would've been better if it weren't so awkward looking with the visually long (but functionally short) bed and had kept two doors. They maybe could've called it BRAT or something.

If not least to expand a small line up and to maximize the investment in the new H6. They need a halo car. And Impreza and Legacy-based coupes, and a light weight application for their engines. They never built that dammed OSCA 2500GT! Oh, and maybe a Legacy Nomad! (j/k I'm probably the only one who'd want that and I'd never buy it new)

Steve

Post by **Legacy777** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 3:58 am

you know why the baja sucks ass.......because SOA did that one on their own.....they just don't get it....

LaureltheQueen · Post by **LaureltheQueen** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 6:39 am

it's a poory executed attempt at an el camino. sick.

Looks like a friggin boat.

legacy92ej22t · Post by **legacy92ej22t** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 7:19 am

LMMFAO, that's it! Laurel got it.

entirelyturbo · Post by **entirelyturbo** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 7:50 am

Me personally, I think the B11S has a better chance than the B9 Scrambler...

The B9 is a hybrid design, I think it's purely experimental...

I do like the Baja Turbos, and I'll tell ya why. Gimme an STi intercooler and ECU and a good set of coilovers, and I'll have a 4-door truck that will kick WRX ass on the strip and on the track!

LaureltheQueen · Post by **LaureltheQueen** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 8:11 am

still looks like Thomas the Tugboat

evolutionmovement · Post by **evolutionmovement** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 9:01 am

The new Subarus are under the charge of the former Alfa Romeo guy (I can't recall his name right now). He did the 156 as well as others. My only problem with his Subarus are the noses. I don't like the center grille - it should be inverted, but then it would look like an Alfa grille... It reminds me of an Edsel or the Kaiser-Darrin. That reminds me, the original inspiration for the Alfa grille as post WWII I heard came from... Oh, maybe I shouldn't say - there are ladies present. They are Italians, though, so keep that in mind. So if you see an old Alfa grille, I'll let you decide from whence it came. Take note of the badge placement, too - I particularly like that detail.

Steve

nubs · Post by **nubs** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 2:50 pm

LaureltheQueen wrote:still looks like Thomas the Tugboat

Here is spy photo of the Baja amphibious model they are hoping will
help sales pick up.

edgarmoresco · Post by **edgarmoresco** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 4:47 pm

Boy! What a funny thread this is. Subaru's main problem is image. Its going to be impossible for them to maintain the "safety & reliability" image and then expect the "sports/performance" gang to buy their product. The SVX died of being a under-hyped mediocre performer in an already crowded niche. They are now trying to appeal to a younger crowd with the WRX with the hope that they upgrade in the future to the next level offering. Unfornately, that next level is going to be a minivan-niche for most of them and Subaru doesn't really play there. The Baja is going to pan out as another "marketing dud" because its priced wrong and again is in a crowded niche. Unfortunately, they missed the minvan craze by electing to go with the Outback instead of a step up to AWD Van (mini or otherwise) class.
Their product offerings just don't have enough range. The Baja is an Outback with yellow paint. The outback is a legacy with big tires. The GT is a legacy with shinny rims. NEED MORE PRODUCTS

edgarmoresco · Post by **edgarmoresco** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 4:48 pm

Boy! What a funny thread this is. Subaru's main problem is image. Its going to be impossible for them to maintain the "safety & reliability" image and then expect the "sports/performance" gang to buy their product. The SVX died of being a under-hyped mediocre performer in an already crowded niche. They are now trying to appeal to a younger crowd with the WRX with the hope that they upgrade in the future to the next level offering. Unfornately, that next level is going to be a minivan-niche for most of them and Subaru doesn't really play there. The Baja is going to pan out as another "marketing dud" because its priced wrong and again is in a crowded niche. Unfortunately, they missed the minvan craze by electing to go with the Outback instead of a step up to AWD Van (mini or otherwise) class.
Their product offerings just don't have enough range. The Baja is an Outback with yellow paint. The outback is a legacy with big tires. The GT is a legacy with shinny rims. NEED MORE PRODUCTS!

91White-T · Post by **91White-T** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 5:07 pm

You know what's wrong with the Baja? I'll tell ya... GM, you can almost see the Aztek/Avalanche influence fuglifying the whole car!

entirelyturbo · Post by **entirelyturbo** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 8:11 pm

Pssst, it's not GM influence at all, the Outback has had the same body cladding since before GM had any share...

The Baja was just a very poorly executed attempt at being a modern Brat. But I'm sure the original Brat was much more useful and had much better off-road capabilities...

Still wanna have a 300-hp, cone-killing, WRX-eating Baja Turbo though

LegacyT · Post by **LegacyT** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 8:24 pm

I like subaru's attage since the beginning stressing fast traction. I think this will be their philosophy for many years to come. Therefore I do see something like a powerful sports coupe emerging out from Subaru's curtains.

Mark,

Polskino · Post by **Polskino** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 9:55 pm

i actually think the Baja is pretty nice. and ya i think the B11 has alot better chance to be accepeted by the north american public then the B9

evolutionmovement · Post by **evolutionmovement** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 10:18 pm

If I remember correctly, the B9 is built off the same platform as the Pontiac Solstice and Vauxhall Lightning concepts.

Steve

entirelyturbo · Post by **entirelyturbo** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 10:25 pm

I see the resemblance:

And I'm not happy about it!

I thought GM was only taking Subaru's ideas and not the other way around!

Polskino · Post by **Polskino** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 10:27 pm

boo i hope gm doesnt start trying to run subaru and start building cars together

evolutionmovement · Post by **evolutionmovement** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 11:00 pm

Bob Lutz really wants to build the Solstice, however being a new rear-drive platform the costs need to be justified and that means volume. I have my own ideas on what they could do to get volume (and they don't involve Subaru), but I'm sure they wouldn't listen to me. That said, I think we're likely safe from the Pontiac B9 as, in my opinion, it was only built as a show car (more to impress the board of directors @ GM - sort of an extended platform feasability study than to impress the public), although it doesn't hurt Subaru to get attention through concepts. It also tests the water on their new design direction and the idea of a Subaru sportscar (nobody remembers their other two).

The familiarity to the public thing is important as the new design direction (at least with the front) is pretty radical and since your average consumers are conservative, and therefore afraid of change, you have to wean them into unfamiliar directions slowly. The more radical, the more weaning and hand holding required. Audi (oh how I hate to contribute to the constant comparisons) has done this with the 'new' style Auto Union retro grille they are introducing in steps starting with fairly radical show cars to overemphasize the point and that makes it seem conservative when several smaller cues are put on an otherwise familiar shape. Less conservative companies have less to no worry about with this, but these guys are large volume (although Subaru is relatively low volume, I'm talking small volume as less than 10 or 5000 units/yr.) and so need to rely on conservative customers not being turned off. Sorry to write another novel, but I did go to school for this stuff.

Steve

FG!! · Post by **FG!!** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 11:20 pm

Yeah, I don't see any problem with a subaru that looks like an alfa. Best of both world to me.

Brat4by4 · Post by **Brat4by4** » Mon Dec 22, 2003 8:58 pm

The B9 never need be built. Something else that can be confused for a S2000, Miata, or Z3. Who cares?

Baja was a very weak attempt to troll for the Brat faithful with lots of money. Too bad it completely sucks without a dual-range transmission...

Forester is a good idea, IMO. Not an SUV, not a minivan, but will take care of the duties of either. Lots of people are saying "I don't want a minivan"... and they get steered to a Forester. Lots and Lots of people are saying "I don't want a truck-based SUV (gas hog) or an econobox 'SUV' because I actually DO need to go offroad..." once again they get steered to the Forester. I would never want one, but I do see it grabbing the tweener SUV market.

evolutionmovement · Post by **evolutionmovement** » Mon Dec 22, 2003 10:11 pm

Forrester's not my style, but I talked an old boss into one over an Explorer and now he's a Subaru guy. It's always better to have another Subaru sold than an Explorer. He couldn't believe how much fun it was to drive over the SUV.
Ever see one next to a Jeep Cherokee? It's amazing how close in size and proportion they are. I think it would be great if Subaru made a more hardcore limited edition Forrester (STI version) to boost their image in another area with dual range and skid plates, plus jacked up a little with different bumpers to look more aggresive and improve incline angles. As it is I've heard countless tales of Subarus doing better off road than 'real offroaders' with higher clearance and such. It would still handle a lot better onroad comparitively, too due to the better CG.

Steve

Brat4by4 · Post by **Brat4by4** » Mon Dec 22, 2003 10:47 pm

STi is performance, not off-road or rally. But I know what you mean, Prodrive Edition Baja or Forester would be great.

If it ain't got a dual-range and 7 1/2"+ of factory clearance don't even try to compare it to a Brat

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Do you think subaru will try another svx-esque car?

Do you think subaru will try another svx-esque car?