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I'm absolutely positive the wires are on the correct terminals.

Are all automotive 5 terminal relays the same? It looks identical to every other one, but on the back of the relay box it says "87 & 87 = Power to Lamps".

Now obviously the relay is originally intended to power lights, but if I'm reading it right, is it saying that 87 and 87a both output the same thing? Wouldn't that just close the circuit inside the relay (and therefore blowing the fuse)?

Heh... I knew it.

Your relays are not like most 5-terminal relays. They're SPST. They have no 87a terminals; instead they have two 87 terminals.

So you have both +12v and ground connected to 87 terminals.

You need to get your hands on some SPDT relays.

Ah ha!

Now where to I find such a relay?

So even though this relay is marked 87 AND 87A, they're really just 2 87's?

Why is it like that, that two relays that look identical and even have the terminals marked identical can be so radically different?

I got this relay at schucks... should I try a car stereo place for a good relay?

You should be able to get them at any respectable auto parts store or electronics supplier... Just make sure they're dual throw.

If you can't find 'em locally, I could send you a couple for a buck each plus $3.85 shipping.

Yep, that was the problem. I had Single Throw Relays. I got them at an auto store.

Seems ridiculous that single throw and dual throw are absolutely identicle on the outside. The terminals are even marked exactly the same.

Went to a car stereo shop, got some Dual Throw relays, and everything works great now!

The terminals are not marked exactly the same. Dual throw relays have terminals marked 87a. Single throw relays do not.

I'm glad you got it sorted out.

vrg3 wrote:The terminals are not marked exactly the same. Dual throw relays have terminals marked 87a. Single throw relays do not.

I'm glad you got it sorted out.

Shall I take a pic of my single throw relay with the 87A on it?

If you have a single throw relay with both 87 and 87a terminals on it, it was mislabeled.

Concerning the door trigger wire...

the only black plug above the hood release I see is attached to some massive wiring harness. There's a white, black, and blue plug all connected to it, with tons of wires. I'm worried that might be connected to a computer. Is this the black plug they're speaking of in the diagram? There arent any other black ones and I've tried unplugging all the ones i see (to see if the door-ajar light on the dash turns off).

EDIT:
The plug I'm talking about can be seen at the bottom of this pic... in the center. You can see the black plug and the white plug... the blue plug sits right below the black one. Do these go to the ECU or some other computer?

http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8 ... cuhide.jpg

EDIT2: Nope, pretty sure that harness isn't correct. First I snipped the red/white, then the white/red wires, and neither of them caused the "door-ajar" light on the dash to turn off.

There isn't a black plug anywhere up above the hood release, and I've already dis-connected all the available plugs, none of them are it. Any ideas?

look for the wire at the plugs that plug into the fuse box on the side, not on a free floating plug. And for the love of god dont go snipping wires just use a multimeter to see if there is current there or not when you push the button thats located on the car side of the door opening towards the bottom.

Technique: Make sure all doors are closed except the drivers door because thats where you are working. ground the negative wire on your multimeter and hold the posotive lead on the multimeter to the suspect wire. it should read 12 volts with the dome light off (make sure you dont have the dome light disabled just in case) while you are holding in the black rubber boot switch found at the lower right hand door jam. (hold it in with your finger) When you release the switch the multimeter should lose the 12 volts. If this does not happen you have the wrong wire. pm me for more help if you still have a prob

Grr, I'm so retardedly frustrated here. I've had all 6 of the plugs going to the fuse box unplugged, plus all 5 of the free-floating plugs near the fuse box unplugged, and STILL the car knows when the door is open and closes (I'm judging by if the dome light turns on and off when I open and close the door).

The one thing I havent tried... there's a group of wires with a Red/White wire going up to what looks like a computer. It connects to a huge plug way up top that I cant reach, and that plug is protected by a piece of plastic that's bolted in. The Red/White wire itself is twined together with a yellow wire on that bunch of wires, so I'm really leery about just snipping it to see if it's the one. Does this sound familiar?

ugh, I'll check in a little bit and just let you know exactly where it is for once and for all.

Yeah, I don't know why I'm having such a retarded time finding this damn wire.

ok, I checked, it is in the black plug above the hood release. Its above it to the right if you are looking directley at it from the drivers seat. It is the Red wire with a white trace located 4th from the right on the top row. Also, make sure your dome light works or this circuit will not work right. also, check that you are using the right wire for the alarm as some have 2 wires one for posotive type door triggers and one for negative types like ours. I need to catch a plane....good luck

I'm sorry but there's gotta be something different about my car. There is only 1 black plug anywhere near the hood release, and it has 5 wires on it (none of which are red&white). Not to mention, that I can unplug that plug and the DomeLight+Dash Light still triggers when I open the door. In fact, I can unplug every plug I see under there and the dome light still works. I'll do my best to find the wire elsewhere

In my experience there are some connectors which are black on some cars and white on some other cars. It might be correlated with the country the cars were assembled in.

Is there any other connectors in the area Mike described that has a red-with-white-stripe wire?

Theres at least one wire I can find, but I can't find the plug for it. It's lost way up in the dash... I'm almost to the point of just snipping it and seeing if that's right

Just to verify, if i DO cut that wire (or unplug the harness) neither the dome light nor the little door indicator on the dash will register that the door is open, right? That's how I've been checking

Okay, here's some more info I just gathered from my 1992 factory service manual. Assuming I'm thinking of the same connector Mike's describing, it's a 22-pin connector, shaped like this:
It looks like the male plug (with female pins) is black plastic on both Japan- and US-built cars.

The connector seems to be vertically oriented; it goes up to the gauge cluster. There are three connectors of the same shape all next each other. This one is black and one of the others is blue. I don't know the color of the third.

If you disconnect that wire, the dome light will stop working, but the little "door open" indicators on the dash should still work. So watch the dome light.

So it IS the black connector on that panel? I thought that plug went to a computer, and even asked so in this thread.

I think my problem was that I was looking at the dash to see if I had snipped the right wire, so when the dummy light on the dash didnt stop working, I assumed I had the wrong wire.

You're a lifesaver vrg. The fact that the light on the gauge doesnt stop working makes this way easier (and makes me feel stupider since I didnt start checking the dome light until after I had checked that plug.

magicmike wrote:Technique: Make sure all doors are closed except the drivers door because thats where you are working. ground the negative wire on your multimeter and hold the posotive lead on the multimeter to the suspect wire. it should read 12 volts with the dome light off (make sure you dont have the dome light disabled just in case) while you are holding in the black rubber boot switch found at the lower right hand door jam. (hold it in with your finger) When you release the switch the multimeter should lose the 12 volts. If this does not happen you have the wrong wire. pm me for more help if you still have a prob

umm yeah, thanks Vikash

Heh, I'm sorry Mike, but I have no multimeter.

My problem was that at first, I was testing by looking at the dash light, and only later was I testing by both the dash AND the dome light.

You guys have both been an awesome help. Hope I get this all worked out tonight after work.

buy a multimeter!!!!! they are less than 10 dollars for goodness sakes

but goodluck none the less

hey mike can you recommend any good places to hide the brain under the dash?

depends on what your installing... an alarm the best place is behind the instrument cluster. on a remote starter just up under the dash above the left foot rest.

Can someone sticky this??