legacycentral bbs

With the installation of the MY'97 intercooler quickly approaching I am now
looking for answers regarding engine managment. At what point does it
become neccesary to add control units for ignition and fuel? Or, at what
point does the stock ECU become unable to compensate for increased boost?

I am currently running the "reroute vacume hose" mod which netted me
12 -12.5psi, only at high ambient temps (above 90 degrees) do I sense the
ECU pulling timing, otherwise all seems well.

Soooo, how far can I go before I need expensive electronic toys and what
will need tweaking first, fuel or ignition?

PeteH
'92 Turbo Sport Sedan, 5-spd of course!


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Or, at what
> point does the stock ECU become unable to compensate for increased
boost?
>

>
> Soooo, how far can I go before I need expensive electronic toys and
what
> will need tweaking first, fuel or ignition?
>
> PeteH


Pete, just by going from what the Mitsubishi guys practice, I would
say fuel would be the first concern. As long as you have enough fuel,
I don't think you'll get into trouble. Being that our cars are
factory Turbos, I would think the ECU is capable of running your
engine for quite some time. Maybe bigger injectors and a bigger fuel
pump, possibly a fuel controller to fine tune everything and I would
think you should be OK but that's not coming from hands on experience
so I don't know for sure. With a 8.0:1 compression ratio, adequete
fuel and a good intercooler, I don't think you would have to worry
about timing for a while, if at all.

BTW, does anyone know ~FOR SURE~ what size injectors the Turbo
Legacys have?


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At 048 PM 10/8/2000 +0000, you wrote:
>Or, at what
> > point does the stock ECU become unable to compensate for increased
>boost?
> >
>
> >
> > Soooo, how far can I go before I need expensive electronic toys and
>what
> > will need tweaking first, fuel or ignition?
> >
> > PeteH
>
>
>Pete, just by going from what the Mitsubishi guys practice, I would
>say fuel would be the first concern. As long as you have enough fuel,
>I don't think you'll get into trouble. Being that our cars are
>factory Turbos, I would think the ECU is capable of running your
>engine for quite some time. Maybe bigger injectors and a bigger fuel
>pump, possibly a fuel controller to fine tune everything and I would
>think you should be OK but that's not coming from hands on experience
>so I don't know for sure. With a 8.0:1 compression ratio, adequete
>fuel and a good intercooler, I don't think you would have to worry
>about timing for a while, if at all.
>
>BTW, does anyone know ~FOR SURE~ what size injectors the Turbo
>Legacys have?

360-380cc/min.

-=[Matt]=-


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The Legacy Turbos have 389cc/min injectors that are considered maxed at
80% duty cycle.

The Superchips folks say that our fuel amd ignition map curves are okay
for at least 14psi. To the best of my knowledge, injectors are a
limiting factor. The fuel pump connector under the back seat is
problematic. If you haven't done so already, solder a jumper around that
little bastard. Your car will gradually become less and less sporty as
the white connector turns brown.

I am still screwing aroud with knock sensor, atmospheric pressure sensor
and mass airflow meter ECU errors, so I am nobody's expert on much of
anything. I am gradually going back to stock ecu control etc. as I
attempt to sort things out.

My ISP is going broke this week so I am now vultureboy@mindspring.com.
What is the prodedure for switching so that this bulletin board
acknowledges my new e-mail?

Bill Robinson
92 Turbo 5-speed

Matt Scicchitano wrote:

> Or, at what
> > point does the stock ECU become unable to compensate for increased
> boost?
> >
>
> >
> > Soooo, how far can I go before I need expensive electronic toys and
> what
> > will need tweaking first, fuel or ignition?
> >
> > PeteH
>
> Pete, just by going from what the Mitsubishi guys practice, I would
> say fuel would be the first concern. As long as you have enough fuel,
> I don't think you'll get into trouble. Being that our cars are
> factory Turbos, I would think the ECU is capable of running your
> engine for quite some time. Maybe bigger injectors and a bigger fuel
> pump, possibly a fuel controller to fine tune everything and I would
> think you should be OK but that's not coming from hands on experience
> so I don't know for sure. With a 8.0:1 compression ratio, adequete
> fuel and a good intercooler, I don't think you would have to worry
> about timing for a while, if at all.
>
> BTW, does anyone know ~FOR SURE~ what size injectors the Turbo
> Legacys have?
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com


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--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "William D. Robinson"
<billrob@i...> wrote:
> The Legacy Turbos have 389cc/min injectors that are considered
maxed at
> 80% duty cycle.
>



Thanks guys for the injector size. I thought I remember Paul Eklund
saying they were in the 380cc range a while back. I'll put it in the
FAQ. Now, that being said, is there a rough estimate of how much
boost you can run with the stock turbo before the injectors begin to
go above 80 percent? I know there are many variables that need to be
considered but just a rough idea would be great.

BTW, thanks for the tip about the connector Bill, I will check that
tomorrow.


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I typoed!!!! The USA Legacy injectors are 380cc/mim, not 389cc/min. They
are quite a bit smaller than the injectors on an EJ20G, so the USA Legacy
(EJ22T)ECU has a longer pulse duration.

Yesterday I sucked a half a can of Seafoam brand decarboniser through my
engine. It spewed a lot of nasty fumes etc, but I still have a knock
sensor error code on my ECU

Bill Robinson

Matt Walters wrote:

> At 048 PM 10/8/2000 +0000, you wrote:
> >Or, at what
> > > point does the stock ECU become unable to compensate for increased
> >boost?
> > >
> >
> > >
> > > Soooo, how far can I go before I need expensive electronic toys and
> >what
> > > will need tweaking first, fuel or ignition?
> > >
> > > PeteH
> >
> >
> >Pete, just by going from what the Mitsubishi guys practice, I would
> >say fuel would be the first concern. As long as you have enough fuel,
> >I don't think you'll get into trouble. Being that our cars are
> >factory Turbos, I would think the ECU is capable of running your
> >engine for quite some time. Maybe bigger injectors and a bigger fuel
> >pump, possibly a fuel controller to fine tune everything and I would
> >think you should be OK but that's not coming from hands on experience
> >so I don't know for sure. With a 8.0:1 compression ratio, adequete
> >fuel and a good intercooler, I don't think you would have to worry
> >about timing for a while, if at all.
> >
> >BTW, does anyone know ~FOR SURE~ what size injectors the Turbo
> >Legacys have?
>
> 360-380cc/min.
>
> -=[Matt]=-
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com


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--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "William D. Robinson" <billrob@i...>
wrote:
> The Legacy Turbos have 389cc/min injectors that are considered
maxed at
> 80% duty cycle.
>
> The Superchips folks say that our fuel amd ignition map curves are
okay
> for at least 14psi. To the best of my knowledge, injectors are a
> limiting factor. The fuel pump connector under the back seat is
> problematic. If you haven't done so already, solder a jumper
around that
> little bastard. Your car will gradually become less and less
sporty as
> the white connector turns brown.
>

ok, so can anyone tell me for sure what the connector looks like that
would be problematic? i had my back seat out a while back and looked
for it but i don't understand what he's talking about.


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The fuel pump connector is under the lower part of the rear seat on
the passengers side. It may be wrapped up with something and hard to
see at first. It is a good idea to jumper this plug as more than one
car has gone up in smoke because of this little item. On injectors if
we went to larger injectors I think we might have a problem with the
low end and milage would probably get worse. The quickest cars around
here have additional injectors that open when boost calls for more
fuel.




--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "mike p." <ob1poor@y...> wrote:
> --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "William D. Robinson" <billrob@i...>
> wrote:
> > The Legacy Turbos have 389cc/min injectors that are considered
> maxed at
> > 80% duty cycle.
> >
> > The Superchips folks say that our fuel amd ignition map curves are
> okay
> > for at least 14psi. To the best of my knowledge, injectors are a
> > limiting factor. The fuel pump connector under the back seat is
> > problematic. If you haven't done so already, solder a jumper
> around that
> > little bastard. Your car will gradually become less and less
> sporty as
> > the white connector turns brown.
> >
>
> ok, so can anyone tell me for sure what the connector looks like
that
> would be problematic? i had my back seat out a while back and
looked
> for it but i don't understand what he's talking about.


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ok, my next question, what would a suitable jumper for this
application be? just a short wire around it, what guage would you
recommend?

--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., acroxford@h... wrote:
> The fuel pump connector is under the lower part of the rear seat on
> the passengers side. It may be wrapped up with something and hard
to
> see at first. It is a good idea to jumper this plug as more than
one
> car has gone up in smoke because of this little item. On injectors
if
> we went to larger injectors I think we might have a problem with
the
> low end and milage would probably get worse. The quickest cars
around
> here have additional injectors that open when boost calls for more
> fuel.
>
>
>
>
> --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "mike p." <ob1poor@y...> wrote:
> > --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "William D. Robinson"
<billrob@i...>
> > wrote:
> > > The Legacy Turbos have 389cc/min injectors that are considered
> > maxed at
> > > 80% duty cycle.
> > >
> > > The Superchips folks say that our fuel amd ignition map curves
are
> > okay
> > > for at least 14psi. To the best of my knowledge, injectors are
a
> > > limiting factor. The fuel pump connector under the back seat is
> > > problematic. If you haven't done so already, solder a jumper
> > around that
> > > little bastard. Your car will gradually become less and less
> > sporty as
> > > the white connector turns brown.
> > >
> >
> > ok, so can anyone tell me for sure what the connector looks like
> that
> > would be problematic? i had my back seat out a while back and
> looked
> > for it but i don't understand what he's talking about.


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Any wire with good insulation and about the same gauge as was used on
the original wiring or a little larger would work fine I think that
the original was 16ga stranded. The problem wasn't with the wire the
connector was a little underated and you wouldn't need much wire
maybe
a few feet.






--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "mike p." <ob1poor@y...> wrote:
> ok, my next question, what would a suitable jumper for this
> application be? just a short wire around it, what guage would you
> recommend?
>
> --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., acroxford@h... wrote:
> > The fuel pump connector is under the lower part of the rear seat
on
> > the passengers side. It may be wrapped up with something and hard
> to
> > see at first. It is a good idea to jumper this plug as more than
> one
> > car has gone up in smoke because of this little item. On
injectors
> if
> > we went to larger injectors I think we might have a problem with
> the
> > low end and milage would probably get worse. The quickest cars
> around
> > here have additional injectors that open when boost calls for
more
> > fuel.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "mike p." <ob1poor@y...> wrote:
> > > --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@y..., "William D. Robinson"
> <billrob@i...>
> > > wrote:
> > > > The Legacy Turbos have 389cc/min injectors that are
considered
> > > maxed at
> > > > 80% duty cycle.
> > > >
> > > > The Superchips folks say that our fuel amd ignition map
curves
> are
> > > okay
> > > > for at least 14psi. To the best of my knowledge, injectors
are
> a
> > > > limiting factor. The fuel pump connector under the back seat
is
> > > > problematic. If you haven't done so already, solder a jumper
> > > around that
> > > > little bastard. Your car will gradually become less and less
> > > sporty as
> > > > the white connector turns brown.
> > > >
> > >
> > > ok, so can anyone tell me for sure what the connector looks
like
> > that
> > > would be problematic? i had my back seat out a while back and
> > looked
> > > for it but i don't understand what he's talking about.


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