Yo Boyz and Gals!
here's a pic of my "bleed valve", which is a 0.7mm
hole in a hose...
cheers,
Miki
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Bleed valve
Moderators: Helpinators, Moderators
-
Miki
Bleed valve
If you look at the two first versions/pics I posted, you'll see an
arrow indicating the bleed valve (a hose on a vacuum line "T"). Just
cut the correct hose and install a "T" (what are these called in
english?) on it, you can see my "T" a little to the right from where
the arrow is. Then just attach a short hose and insert "something"
with the appropriate sized hole in it. As said, I have a 0.7mm hole
in mine and that "fools" the ECU (or whatever) about 0.25-0.3bar/3.5-
4.5psi... This "fix" should cost you about $2-3 and take about 5mins
to install...
cheers,
Miki
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "Ben Lam" <b.lam@u...> wrote:
> Miki, thanks for the photo, and I wants to know where is the hose
> connect from and where is it connect to?
> hows the bleed valve looks like and where can I get it?
> I'm sorry to give you this kind of problem, but I think I needs
this
> kind of set up for my turbo!
> Man, who doesn't wants to run fast!! (^u^)..hehe
> Hope you do have time to take some more photo to show us!!
> Enjoy your Legacy!
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
arrow indicating the bleed valve (a hose on a vacuum line "T"). Just
cut the correct hose and install a "T" (what are these called in
english?) on it, you can see my "T" a little to the right from where
the arrow is. Then just attach a short hose and insert "something"
with the appropriate sized hole in it. As said, I have a 0.7mm hole
in mine and that "fools" the ECU (or whatever) about 0.25-0.3bar/3.5-
4.5psi... This "fix" should cost you about $2-3 and take about 5mins
to install...
cheers,
Miki
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "Ben Lam" <b.lam@u...> wrote:
> Miki, thanks for the photo, and I wants to know where is the hose
> connect from and where is it connect to?
> hows the bleed valve looks like and where can I get it?
> I'm sorry to give you this kind of problem, but I think I needs
this
> kind of set up for my turbo!
> Man, who doesn't wants to run fast!! (^u^)..hehe
> Hope you do have time to take some more photo to show us!!
> Enjoy your Legacy!
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
-
JohnnyG
Bleed valve
Miki, Yes, this modification does work, but let's understand how... I don't
actually agree with it as a first step in the quest for more power. I have
looked at your pics that you have uploaded, and as I don't actually own a
BC--BF turbo, I can't be sure... but if the bleed valve is actually in the
MAP sensor pneumatic circuit, all this mod does is "fool" the ECU into
thinking that the manifold / boost pressure is lower than it actually is.
The effect is... that the ECU will open the wastegate later, as is engine
cut deferred. ie. all that happens, is your engine is allowed to operate in
higher stressed range... and I as stated in an earlier post, your cold
climate allows you to do this with a relatively "safe"margin.
With this in mind, my :recommended first step with a bleed-valve
modification, is to defer wastefgate operation by adding a bleed valve (or
better variations of same) to the wastegate actuator pneumatic circuit
(principle is same as a boost controller)... rather than "deferring" the
pressure that the ECU actually sees (bleeding the MAP sensor pneumatic
circuit).
Let's be clear, in setting performance objectives... the name of the game is
to build boost earlier in the rev range... not necessarily to build the
highest amount of boost.
John Gillon
www.clubsub.org.nz
----- Original Message -----
From: Miki <awdturbodude@yahoo.com>
To: <BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2001 9:16 PM
Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: Bleed valve
> If you look at the two first versions/pics I posted, you'll see an
> arrow indicating the bleed valve (a hose on a vacuum line "T"). Just
> cut the correct hose and install a "T" (what are these called in
> english?) on it, you can see my "T" a little to the right from where
> the arrow is. Then just attach a short hose and insert "something"
> with the appropriate sized hole in it. As said, I have a 0.7mm hole
> in mine and that "fools" the ECU (or whatever) about 0.25-0.3bar/3.5-
> 4.5psi... This "fix" should cost you about $2-3 and take about 5mins
> to install...
>
> cheers,
>
> Miki
>
>
> --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "Ben Lam" <b.lam@u...> wrote:
> > Miki, thanks for the photo, and I wants to know where is the hose
> > connect from and where is it connect to?
> > hows the bleed valve looks like and where can I get it?
> > I'm sorry to give you this kind of problem, but I think I needs
> this
> > kind of set up for my turbo!
> > Man, who doesn't wants to run fast!! (^u^)..hehe
> > Hope you do have time to take some more photo to show us!!
> > Enjoy your Legacy!
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
>
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
actually agree with it as a first step in the quest for more power. I have
looked at your pics that you have uploaded, and as I don't actually own a
BC--BF turbo, I can't be sure... but if the bleed valve is actually in the
MAP sensor pneumatic circuit, all this mod does is "fool" the ECU into
thinking that the manifold / boost pressure is lower than it actually is.
The effect is... that the ECU will open the wastegate later, as is engine
cut deferred. ie. all that happens, is your engine is allowed to operate in
higher stressed range... and I as stated in an earlier post, your cold
climate allows you to do this with a relatively "safe"margin.
With this in mind, my :recommended first step with a bleed-valve
modification, is to defer wastefgate operation by adding a bleed valve (or
better variations of same) to the wastegate actuator pneumatic circuit
(principle is same as a boost controller)... rather than "deferring" the
pressure that the ECU actually sees (bleeding the MAP sensor pneumatic
circuit).
Let's be clear, in setting performance objectives... the name of the game is
to build boost earlier in the rev range... not necessarily to build the
highest amount of boost.
John Gillon
www.clubsub.org.nz
----- Original Message -----
From: Miki <awdturbodude@yahoo.com>
To: <BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2001 9:16 PM
Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: Bleed valve
> If you look at the two first versions/pics I posted, you'll see an
> arrow indicating the bleed valve (a hose on a vacuum line "T"). Just
> cut the correct hose and install a "T" (what are these called in
> english?) on it, you can see my "T" a little to the right from where
> the arrow is. Then just attach a short hose and insert "something"
> with the appropriate sized hole in it. As said, I have a 0.7mm hole
> in mine and that "fools" the ECU (or whatever) about 0.25-0.3bar/3.5-
> 4.5psi... This "fix" should cost you about $2-3 and take about 5mins
> to install...
>
> cheers,
>
> Miki
>
>
> --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "Ben Lam" <b.lam@u...> wrote:
> > Miki, thanks for the photo, and I wants to know where is the hose
> > connect from and where is it connect to?
> > hows the bleed valve looks like and where can I get it?
> > I'm sorry to give you this kind of problem, but I think I needs
> this
> > kind of set up for my turbo!
> > Man, who doesn't wants to run fast!! (^u^)..hehe
> > Hope you do have time to take some more photo to show us!!
> > Enjoy your Legacy!
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
>
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
-
Matt Scicchitano
Bleed valve
.
>
> With this in mind, my :recommended first step with a bleed-valve
> modification, is to defer wastefgate operation by adding a bleed
valve (or
> better variations of same) to the wastegate actuator pneumatic
circuit
> (principle is same as a boost controller)... rather than
"deferring" the
> pressure that the ECU actually sees (bleeding the MAP sensor
pneumatic
> circuit).
Yes, and since you still need to raise your "boost cut", add a boost
controller such as the Hallman to the Map sensor line as well, so you
don't totally eliminate the safety of the boost cut, but rather raise
it to wherever you want it.
-Matt
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
> With this in mind, my :recommended first step with a bleed-valve
> modification, is to defer wastefgate operation by adding a bleed
valve (or
> better variations of same) to the wastegate actuator pneumatic
circuit
> (principle is same as a boost controller)... rather than
"deferring" the
> pressure that the ECU actually sees (bleeding the MAP sensor
pneumatic
> circuit).
Yes, and since you still need to raise your "boost cut", add a boost
controller such as the Hallman to the Map sensor line as well, so you
don't totally eliminate the safety of the boost cut, but rather raise
it to wherever you want it.
-Matt
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
-
Miki
Bleed valve
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "JohnnyG" <grilla@i...> wrote:
>Miki, Yes, this modification does work, but let's understand how...
>I don't actually agree with it as a first step in the quest for more
>power. I have looked at your pics that you have uploaded, and as I
>don't actually own a BC--BF turbo, I can't be sure... but if the
>bleed valve is actually in the MAP sensor pneumatic circuit, all
>this mod does is "fool" the ECU into thinking that the manifold /
>boost pressure is lower than it actually is.
>The effect is... that the ECU will open the wastegate later, as is
>engine cut deferred. ie. all that happens, is your engine is allowed
>to operate in higher stressed range... and I as stated in an earlier
>post, your cold climate allows you to do this with a
>relatively "safe"margin.
Yes, this was also the goal then, the mechanic who did it couldn't
find any way to actually lower the boost, except by mounting a couple
of plates under the mounting of the wastegate, which then kept it
from closing 100%. That way the boost didn't build up quite as fast
and high. He thought that this way I got everything out of it...
that's probably true, but I'd like to drive my fast car for quite
long, at least more than a couple of weeks before the engine pops...
>With this in mind, my :recommended first step with a bleed-valve
>modification, is to defer wastefgate operation by adding a bleed
>valve (or better variations of same) to the wastegate actuator
>pneumatic circuit (principle is same as a boost controller)...
>rather than "deferring" the pressure that the ECU actually sees
>(bleeding the MAP sensor pneumatic circuit).
Let's see if I got this right now... you recommend that I put
somekind of bleed valve e.g. a similar to the one I have on the MAP
sensor, but to the hose that goes to the wastegate? Sorry for
repeating the same thing over and over, I just have some problems
understanding the fancy words in the english language sometimes, need
to have it spelled out using a bit more simple words...
>
> Let's be clear, in setting performance objectives... the name of
>the game is to build boost earlier in the rev range... not
>necessarily to build the highest amount of boost.
>
John, I agree 100%, it's just that the boost got this high when I
started to modify the exhaust (and of course due to the chip I have),
but I'll have to get it "under control" somehow.
cheers,
Miki
> John Gillon
> www.clubsub.org.nz
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Miki <awdturbodude@y...>
> To: <BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2001 9:16 PM
> Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: Bleed valve
>
>
> > If you look at the two first versions/pics I posted, you'll see an
> > arrow indicating the bleed valve (a hose on a vacuum line "T").
> > Justcut the correct hose and install a "T" (what are these called
> > in english?) on it, you can see my "T" a little to the right from
> > where the arrow is. Then just attach a short hose and
> > insert "something" with the appropriate sized hole in it. As
> > said, I have a 0.7mm hole in mine and that "fools" the ECU (or
> > whatever) about 0.25-0.3bar/3.5-4.5psi... This "fix" should cost
> > you about $2-3 and take about 5mins to install...
> >
> > cheers,
> >
> > Miki
> >
> >
> > --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "Ben Lam" <b.lam@u...> wrote:
> > > Miki, thanks for the photo, and I wants to know where is the
hose
> > > connect from and where is it connect to?
> > > hows the bleed valve looks like and where can I get it?
> > > I'm sorry to give you this kind of problem, but I think I needs
> > this
> > > kind of set up for my turbo!
> > > Man, who doesn't wants to run fast!! (^u^)..hehe
> > > Hope you do have time to take some more photo to show us!!
> > > Enjoy your Legacy!
> >
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>Miki, Yes, this modification does work, but let's understand how...
>I don't actually agree with it as a first step in the quest for more
>power. I have looked at your pics that you have uploaded, and as I
>don't actually own a BC--BF turbo, I can't be sure... but if the
>bleed valve is actually in the MAP sensor pneumatic circuit, all
>this mod does is "fool" the ECU into thinking that the manifold /
>boost pressure is lower than it actually is.
>The effect is... that the ECU will open the wastegate later, as is
>engine cut deferred. ie. all that happens, is your engine is allowed
>to operate in higher stressed range... and I as stated in an earlier
>post, your cold climate allows you to do this with a
>relatively "safe"margin.
Yes, this was also the goal then, the mechanic who did it couldn't
find any way to actually lower the boost, except by mounting a couple
of plates under the mounting of the wastegate, which then kept it
from closing 100%. That way the boost didn't build up quite as fast
and high. He thought that this way I got everything out of it...
that's probably true, but I'd like to drive my fast car for quite
long, at least more than a couple of weeks before the engine pops...
>With this in mind, my :recommended first step with a bleed-valve
>modification, is to defer wastefgate operation by adding a bleed
>valve (or better variations of same) to the wastegate actuator
>pneumatic circuit (principle is same as a boost controller)...
>rather than "deferring" the pressure that the ECU actually sees
>(bleeding the MAP sensor pneumatic circuit).
Let's see if I got this right now... you recommend that I put
somekind of bleed valve e.g. a similar to the one I have on the MAP
sensor, but to the hose that goes to the wastegate? Sorry for
repeating the same thing over and over, I just have some problems
understanding the fancy words in the english language sometimes, need
to have it spelled out using a bit more simple words...
>
> Let's be clear, in setting performance objectives... the name of
>the game is to build boost earlier in the rev range... not
>necessarily to build the highest amount of boost.
>
John, I agree 100%, it's just that the boost got this high when I
started to modify the exhaust (and of course due to the chip I have),
but I'll have to get it "under control" somehow.
cheers,
Miki
> John Gillon
> www.clubsub.org.nz
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Miki <awdturbodude@y...>
> To: <BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2001 9:16 PM
> Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: Bleed valve
>
>
> > If you look at the two first versions/pics I posted, you'll see an
> > arrow indicating the bleed valve (a hose on a vacuum line "T").
> > Justcut the correct hose and install a "T" (what are these called
> > in english?) on it, you can see my "T" a little to the right from
> > where the arrow is. Then just attach a short hose and
> > insert "something" with the appropriate sized hole in it. As
> > said, I have a 0.7mm hole in mine and that "fools" the ECU (or
> > whatever) about 0.25-0.3bar/3.5-4.5psi... This "fix" should cost
> > you about $2-3 and take about 5mins to install...
> >
> > cheers,
> >
> > Miki
> >
> >
> > --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "Ben Lam" <b.lam@u...> wrote:
> > > Miki, thanks for the photo, and I wants to know where is the
hose
> > > connect from and where is it connect to?
> > > hows the bleed valve looks like and where can I get it?
> > > I'm sorry to give you this kind of problem, but I think I needs
> > this
> > > kind of set up for my turbo!
> > > Man, who doesn't wants to run fast!! (^u^)..hehe
> > > Hope you do have time to take some more photo to show us!!
> > > Enjoy your Legacy!
> >
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
-
JohnnyG
Bleed valve
In this case, Miki from Finland has an EJ20G where the stock boost cut
operates about 16-17psi... if I remember correctly the stock MAP sensor span
is about 20psi.
Raising the actual boost above 15 psi is not so much an issue for the EJ20G
(nor desirable IMO), and the objective is more of getting boost earlier...
an additional boost control on the MAP sensor is not so necessary as it is
may be on the USA model.
John Gillon
www.clubsub.org.nz
----- Original Message -----
From: Matt Scicchitano <nzwrc1@sunlink.net>
To: <BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com>
Sent: Monday, January 15, 2001 10 AM
Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: Bleed valve
> .
> >
> > With this in mind, my :recommended first step with a bleed-valve
> > modification, is to defer wastefgate operation by adding a bleed
> valve (or
> > better variations of same) to the wastegate actuator pneumatic
> circuit
> > (principle is same as a boost controller)... rather than
> "deferring" the
> > pressure that the ECU actually sees (bleeding the MAP sensor
> pneumatic
> > circuit).
>
> Yes, and since you still need to raise your "boost cut", add a boost
> controller such as the Hallman to the Map sensor line as well, so you
> don't totally eliminate the safety of the boost cut, but rather raise
> it to wherever you want it.
>
> -Matt
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
>
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
operates about 16-17psi... if I remember correctly the stock MAP sensor span
is about 20psi.
Raising the actual boost above 15 psi is not so much an issue for the EJ20G
(nor desirable IMO), and the objective is more of getting boost earlier...
an additional boost control on the MAP sensor is not so necessary as it is
may be on the USA model.
John Gillon
www.clubsub.org.nz
----- Original Message -----
From: Matt Scicchitano <nzwrc1@sunlink.net>
To: <BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com>
Sent: Monday, January 15, 2001 10 AM
Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: Bleed valve
> .
> >
> > With this in mind, my :recommended first step with a bleed-valve
> > modification, is to defer wastefgate operation by adding a bleed
> valve (or
> > better variations of same) to the wastegate actuator pneumatic
> circuit
> > (principle is same as a boost controller)... rather than
> "deferring" the
> > pressure that the ECU actually sees (bleeding the MAP sensor
> pneumatic
> > circuit).
>
> Yes, and since you still need to raise your "boost cut", add a boost
> controller such as the Hallman to the Map sensor line as well, so you
> don't totally eliminate the safety of the boost cut, but rather raise
> it to wherever you want it.
>
> -Matt
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
>
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
-
JohnnyG
Bleed valve
Hiya Miki,
> couldn't
> find any way to actually lower the boost, except by mounting a couple
> of plates under the mounting of the wastegate, which then kept it
> from closing 100%.
I understand your description... but "mounting plates under the wastegate
mounting" doesn't make sense. Maybe a picture would help my understanding of
the objective.
> but to the hose that goes to the wastegate
Yes, this is what I recommend for your EJ20G, and I would also recommend
removal of your bleed valve on the MAP sensor. The EJ20G will make your
target power with 15 psi boost, and with the stock MAP sensor and ECU
providing boost cut at about 16-17 psi.
> spelled out using a bit more simple words
I understand... I will try to adjust my English
...but I must add that
your English is very good.
I will shortly post a more elaborate pneumatic circuit modification in the
File section, that provides very precise control of the wastegate actuator,
and is almost as good as boost controller.
John Gillon
www.clubsub.org.nz
----- Original Message -----
From: Miki <awdturbodude@yahoo.com>
To: <BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2001 2:57 AM
Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: Bleed valve
> --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "JohnnyG" <grilla@i...> wrote:
> >Miki, Yes, this modification does work, but let's understand how...
> >I don't actually agree with it as a first step in the quest for more
> >power. I have looked at your pics that you have uploaded, and as I
> >don't actually own a BC--BF turbo, I can't be sure... but if the
> >bleed valve is actually in the MAP sensor pneumatic circuit, all
> >this mod does is "fool" the ECU into thinking that the manifold /
> >boost pressure is lower than it actually is.
> >The effect is... that the ECU will open the wastegate later, as is
> >engine cut deferred. ie. all that happens, is your engine is allowed
> >to operate in higher stressed range... and I as stated in an earlier
> >post, your cold climate allows you to do this with a
> >relatively "safe"margin.
>
> Yes, this was also the goal then, the mechanic who did it couldn't
> find any way to actually lower the boost, except by mounting a couple
> of plates under the mounting of the wastegate, which then kept it
> from closing 100%. That way the boost didn't build up quite as fast
> and high. He thought that this way I got everything out of it...
> that's probably true, but I'd like to drive my fast car for quite
> long, at least more than a couple of weeks before the engine pops...
>
> >With this in mind, my :recommended first step with a bleed-valve
> >modification, is to defer wastefgate operation by adding a bleed
> >valve (or better variations of same) to the wastegate actuator
> >pneumatic circuit (principle is same as a boost controller)...
> >rather than "deferring" the pressure that the ECU actually sees
> >(bleeding the MAP sensor pneumatic circuit).
>
> Let's see if I got this right now... you recommend that I put
> somekind of bleed valve e.g. a similar to the one I have on the MAP
> sensor, but to the hose that goes to the wastegate? Sorry for
> repeating the same thing over and over, I just have some problems
> understanding the fancy words in the english language sometimes, need
> to have it spelled out using a bit more simple words...
>
> >
> > Let's be clear, in setting performance objectives... the name of
> >the game is to build boost earlier in the rev range... not
> >necessarily to build the highest amount of boost.
> >
>
> John, I agree 100%, it's just that the boost got this high when I
> started to modify the exhaust (and of course due to the chip I have),
> but I'll have to get it "under control" somehow.
>
> cheers,
>
> Miki
>
>
> > John Gillon
> > www.clubsub.org.nz
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Miki <awdturbodude@y...>
> > To: <BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com>
> > Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2001 9:16 PM
> > Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: Bleed valve
> >
> >
> > > If you look at the two first versions/pics I posted, you'll see an
> > > arrow indicating the bleed valve (a hose on a vacuum line "T").
> > > Justcut the correct hose and install a "T" (what are these called
> > > in english?) on it, you can see my "T" a little to the right from
> > > where the arrow is. Then just attach a short hose and
> > > insert "something" with the appropriate sized hole in it. As
> > > said, I have a 0.7mm hole in mine and that "fools" the ECU (or
> > > whatever) about 0.25-0.3bar/3.5-4.5psi... This "fix" should cost
> > > you about $2-3 and take about 5mins to install...
> > >
> > > cheers,
> > >
> > > Miki
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "Ben Lam" <b.lam@u...> wrote:
> > > > Miki, thanks for the photo, and I wants to know where is the
> hose
> > > > connect from and where is it connect to?
> > > > hows the bleed valve looks like and where can I get it?
> > > > I'm sorry to give you this kind of problem, but I think I needs
> > > this
> > > > kind of set up for my turbo!
> > > > Man, who doesn't wants to run fast!! (^u^)..hehe
> > > > Hope you do have time to take some more photo to show us!!
> > > > Enjoy your Legacy!
> > >
> > >
> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > > BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
>
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> couldn't
> find any way to actually lower the boost, except by mounting a couple
> of plates under the mounting of the wastegate, which then kept it
> from closing 100%.
I understand your description... but "mounting plates under the wastegate
mounting" doesn't make sense. Maybe a picture would help my understanding of
the objective.
> but to the hose that goes to the wastegate
Yes, this is what I recommend for your EJ20G, and I would also recommend
removal of your bleed valve on the MAP sensor. The EJ20G will make your
target power with 15 psi boost, and with the stock MAP sensor and ECU
providing boost cut at about 16-17 psi.
> spelled out using a bit more simple words
I understand... I will try to adjust my English
...but I must add thatyour English is very good.
I will shortly post a more elaborate pneumatic circuit modification in the
File section, that provides very precise control of the wastegate actuator,
and is almost as good as boost controller.
John Gillon
www.clubsub.org.nz
----- Original Message -----
From: Miki <awdturbodude@yahoo.com>
To: <BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2001 2:57 AM
Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: Bleed valve
> --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "JohnnyG" <grilla@i...> wrote:
> >Miki, Yes, this modification does work, but let's understand how...
> >I don't actually agree with it as a first step in the quest for more
> >power. I have looked at your pics that you have uploaded, and as I
> >don't actually own a BC--BF turbo, I can't be sure... but if the
> >bleed valve is actually in the MAP sensor pneumatic circuit, all
> >this mod does is "fool" the ECU into thinking that the manifold /
> >boost pressure is lower than it actually is.
> >The effect is... that the ECU will open the wastegate later, as is
> >engine cut deferred. ie. all that happens, is your engine is allowed
> >to operate in higher stressed range... and I as stated in an earlier
> >post, your cold climate allows you to do this with a
> >relatively "safe"margin.
>
> Yes, this was also the goal then, the mechanic who did it couldn't
> find any way to actually lower the boost, except by mounting a couple
> of plates under the mounting of the wastegate, which then kept it
> from closing 100%. That way the boost didn't build up quite as fast
> and high. He thought that this way I got everything out of it...
> that's probably true, but I'd like to drive my fast car for quite
> long, at least more than a couple of weeks before the engine pops...
>
> >With this in mind, my :recommended first step with a bleed-valve
> >modification, is to defer wastefgate operation by adding a bleed
> >valve (or better variations of same) to the wastegate actuator
> >pneumatic circuit (principle is same as a boost controller)...
> >rather than "deferring" the pressure that the ECU actually sees
> >(bleeding the MAP sensor pneumatic circuit).
>
> Let's see if I got this right now... you recommend that I put
> somekind of bleed valve e.g. a similar to the one I have on the MAP
> sensor, but to the hose that goes to the wastegate? Sorry for
> repeating the same thing over and over, I just have some problems
> understanding the fancy words in the english language sometimes, need
> to have it spelled out using a bit more simple words...
>
> >
> > Let's be clear, in setting performance objectives... the name of
> >the game is to build boost earlier in the rev range... not
> >necessarily to build the highest amount of boost.
> >
>
> John, I agree 100%, it's just that the boost got this high when I
> started to modify the exhaust (and of course due to the chip I have),
> but I'll have to get it "under control" somehow.
>
> cheers,
>
> Miki
>
>
> > John Gillon
> > www.clubsub.org.nz
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Miki <awdturbodude@y...>
> > To: <BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com>
> > Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2001 9:16 PM
> > Subject: [BC-BFLegacyWorks] Re: Bleed valve
> >
> >
> > > If you look at the two first versions/pics I posted, you'll see an
> > > arrow indicating the bleed valve (a hose on a vacuum line "T").
> > > Justcut the correct hose and install a "T" (what are these called
> > > in english?) on it, you can see my "T" a little to the right from
> > > where the arrow is. Then just attach a short hose and
> > > insert "something" with the appropriate sized hole in it. As
> > > said, I have a 0.7mm hole in mine and that "fools" the ECU (or
> > > whatever) about 0.25-0.3bar/3.5-4.5psi... This "fix" should cost
> > > you about $2-3 and take about 5mins to install...
> > >
> > > cheers,
> > >
> > > Miki
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "Ben Lam" <b.lam@u...> wrote:
> > > > Miki, thanks for the photo, and I wants to know where is the
> hose
> > > > connect from and where is it connect to?
> > > > hows the bleed valve looks like and where can I get it?
> > > > I'm sorry to give you this kind of problem, but I think I needs
> > > this
> > > > kind of set up for my turbo!
> > > > Man, who doesn't wants to run fast!! (^u^)..hehe
> > > > Hope you do have time to take some more photo to show us!!
> > > > Enjoy your Legacy!
> > >
> > >
> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > > BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
>
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-
Miki
Bleed valve
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "JohnnyG" <grilla@i...> wrote:
>"mounting plates under the wastegate mounting" doesn't make sense.
>Maybe a picture would help my understanding of the objective.
I've got no pic of this, but... the wastegate is mounted with three
bolts to the engine very near the manifold (I'm not standing next to
the car right now, this is how I remember it), and under two of the
bolts he put the plates. In my understanding all it did was that it
sort of pushed the wastegate actuator arm (!!!???) a bit, and thus
prevented the wastegate to fully close... beats me, but it worked,
the boost did not go as high as without the two (1mm) plates...
> Yes, this is what I recommend for your EJ20G, and I would also
> recommend removal of your bleed valve on the MAP sensor.
Plan on testing this asap...
> I will shortly post a more elaborate pneumatic circuit modification
> in the File section, that provides very precise control of the
> wastegate actuator, and is almost as good as boost controller.
I'm waiting...
* Miki *
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>"mounting plates under the wastegate mounting" doesn't make sense.
>Maybe a picture would help my understanding of the objective.
I've got no pic of this, but... the wastegate is mounted with three
bolts to the engine very near the manifold (I'm not standing next to
the car right now, this is how I remember it), and under two of the
bolts he put the plates. In my understanding all it did was that it
sort of pushed the wastegate actuator arm (!!!???) a bit, and thus
prevented the wastegate to fully close... beats me, but it worked,
the boost did not go as high as without the two (1mm) plates...
> Yes, this is what I recommend for your EJ20G, and I would also
> recommend removal of your bleed valve on the MAP sensor.
Plan on testing this asap...
> I will shortly post a more elaborate pneumatic circuit modification
> in the File section, that provides very precise control of the
> wastegate actuator, and is almost as good as boost controller.
I'm waiting...
* Miki *
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-
Matt Scicchitano
Bleed valve
> > Yes, and since you still need to raise your "boost cut", add a
boost
> > controller such as the Hallman to the Map sensor line as well, so
you
> > don't totally eliminate the safety of the boost cut, but rather
raise
> > it to wherever you want it.
> >
> > -Matt
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "JohnnyG" <grilla@i...> wrote:
> In this case, Miki from Finland has an EJ20G where the stock boost
cut
> operates about 16-17psi... if I remember correctly the stock MAP
sensor span
> is about 20psi.
>
> Raising the actual boost above 15 psi is not so much an issue for
the EJ20G
> (nor desirable IMO), and the objective is more of getting boost
earlier...
> an additional boost control on the MAP sensor is not so necessary
as it is
> may be on the USA model.
> > Yes, and since you still need to raise your "boost cut", add a
boost
> > controller such as the Hallman to the Map sensor line as well, so
you
> > don't totally eliminate the safety of the boost cut, but rather
raise
> > it to wherever you want it.
> >
> > -Matt
I thought in a recent post that Miki stated he would like to run
between 17-19psi which is why I suggested to still add a boost
controller to the map sensor.
-Matt
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boost
> > controller such as the Hallman to the Map sensor line as well, so
you
> > don't totally eliminate the safety of the boost cut, but rather
raise
> > it to wherever you want it.
> >
> > -Matt
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "JohnnyG" <grilla@i...> wrote:
> In this case, Miki from Finland has an EJ20G where the stock boost
cut
> operates about 16-17psi... if I remember correctly the stock MAP
sensor span
> is about 20psi.
>
> Raising the actual boost above 15 psi is not so much an issue for
the EJ20G
> (nor desirable IMO), and the objective is more of getting boost
earlier...
> an additional boost control on the MAP sensor is not so necessary
as it is
> may be on the USA model.
> > Yes, and since you still need to raise your "boost cut", add a
boost
> > controller such as the Hallman to the Map sensor line as well, so
you
> > don't totally eliminate the safety of the boost cut, but rather
raise
> > it to wherever you want it.
> >
> > -Matt
I thought in a recent post that Miki stated he would like to run
between 17-19psi which is why I suggested to still add a boost
controller to the map sensor.
-Matt
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-
JohnnyG
Bleed valve
> I've got no pic of this, but... the wastegate is mounted with three
> bolts to the engine very near the manifold (I'm not standing next to
> the car right now, this is how I remember it), and under two of the
> bolts he put the plates. In my understanding all it did was that it
> sort of pushed the wastegate actuator arm (!!!???) a bit, and thus
> prevented the wastegate to fully close... beats me, but it worked,
> the boost did not go as high as without the two (1mm) plates...
Ahhh... I now understand what he was trying to achieve with this
modification. Adding the plates on the turbo mounting, creates an adjustment
to the travel of the wastegate actuator arm... it is crude but it would work
in reducing boost pressure.. This modification defeats the objective of
delaying the opening of the wastegate.... it only has a small postive impact
on opening the wastegate earlier to relieve boost (but across the rev range,
which is not good), and a bigger negative impact on building boost earlier
... as the wastegate is always partly open and the turbo lagging in the low
rev range. ie. leaking!
> > Yes, this is what I recommend for your EJ20G, and I would also
> > recommend removal of your bleed valve on the MAP sensor.
>
> Plan on testing this asap...
It is possible that you could use the bleed valve that you currently have on
the MAP sensor, and move it to the wastgate actuator. For a quick
experiment...
1 : Remove the 1mm wastegate spacer plates and the MAP sensor bleed valve,
and return to the stock setup, and you will probably have about 11-12 psi
boost... the low-mid range driveability will be improved and feel very
responsive on the pedal.
2 : Fit the bleed valve to the wastegate actuator, you will get adjustable
boost to about 16-17 psi... but setting the boost to about 12-15 psi is
recommended with the EJ20G setup. You will need to experiment with the bleed
valve setting, but you will find that good low end driveability is
maintained, and there is very strong upper-mid range performance.
> > I will shortly post a more elaborate pneumatic circuit modification
> > in the File section, that provides very precise control of the
> > wastegate actuator, and is almost as good as boost controller.
>
> I'm waiting...
This is the next step, that you must consider. Item 2: above is a crude
solution that has limitations (although it works very well)...
3 : Other more elaborate pneumatic and electronic boost controls provide
better driveability, and are very suitable for 16-17 psi boost (250 hp
range). Please be patient with my posting a drawing on pneumatic circuits...
I am a slow artist
The next step...
4 : 20 psi boost (300+hp target) requires many "tweaks" to the engine
management map. At this point, a complete replacement ECU is a better
solution.
After these steps, mods to an EJ20 become extreme... WRX heads, bigger
manifold and injectors, cams, 3.90 diffs (sealed road use), clutch,
anti-lag... yeaaaahh, yeah
Miki, I hope you understand my English, and your current EJ20G setup and the
modifications to it. ie. adding a bleed valve to the MAP sensor has "fooled"
the ECU into building more "peak" power... which provides "exciting" high
rev performance, but causes problems with over boost / ECU retarding
ignition, etc.
Adding spacers to the wastegate travel and allowing the wastegate to leak,
simply offsets the onset of overboost, and is bad for low end performance.
If you were to follow my recommendation in modifying the operation of the
wastegate, you could safely raise the stock peak boost to 15 psi, and you
would have faster onset of boost and peak boost at lower revs. Please
feedback that you understand the above... I hope I am not using too many
complicated words (I am involved in international technical trade, and I do
understand the problems in communicating in technical English)
John Gillon
www.clubsub.org.nz
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
> bolts to the engine very near the manifold (I'm not standing next to
> the car right now, this is how I remember it), and under two of the
> bolts he put the plates. In my understanding all it did was that it
> sort of pushed the wastegate actuator arm (!!!???) a bit, and thus
> prevented the wastegate to fully close... beats me, but it worked,
> the boost did not go as high as without the two (1mm) plates...
Ahhh... I now understand what he was trying to achieve with this
modification. Adding the plates on the turbo mounting, creates an adjustment
to the travel of the wastegate actuator arm... it is crude but it would work
in reducing boost pressure.. This modification defeats the objective of
delaying the opening of the wastegate.... it only has a small postive impact
on opening the wastegate earlier to relieve boost (but across the rev range,
which is not good), and a bigger negative impact on building boost earlier
... as the wastegate is always partly open and the turbo lagging in the low
rev range. ie. leaking!
> > Yes, this is what I recommend for your EJ20G, and I would also
> > recommend removal of your bleed valve on the MAP sensor.
>
> Plan on testing this asap...
It is possible that you could use the bleed valve that you currently have on
the MAP sensor, and move it to the wastgate actuator. For a quick
experiment...
1 : Remove the 1mm wastegate spacer plates and the MAP sensor bleed valve,
and return to the stock setup, and you will probably have about 11-12 psi
boost... the low-mid range driveability will be improved and feel very
responsive on the pedal.
2 : Fit the bleed valve to the wastegate actuator, you will get adjustable
boost to about 16-17 psi... but setting the boost to about 12-15 psi is
recommended with the EJ20G setup. You will need to experiment with the bleed
valve setting, but you will find that good low end driveability is
maintained, and there is very strong upper-mid range performance.
> > I will shortly post a more elaborate pneumatic circuit modification
> > in the File section, that provides very precise control of the
> > wastegate actuator, and is almost as good as boost controller.
>
> I'm waiting...
This is the next step, that you must consider. Item 2: above is a crude
solution that has limitations (although it works very well)...
3 : Other more elaborate pneumatic and electronic boost controls provide
better driveability, and are very suitable for 16-17 psi boost (250 hp
range). Please be patient with my posting a drawing on pneumatic circuits...
I am a slow artist
The next step...
4 : 20 psi boost (300+hp target) requires many "tweaks" to the engine
management map. At this point, a complete replacement ECU is a better
solution.
After these steps, mods to an EJ20 become extreme... WRX heads, bigger
manifold and injectors, cams, 3.90 diffs (sealed road use), clutch,
anti-lag... yeaaaahh, yeah
Miki, I hope you understand my English, and your current EJ20G setup and the
modifications to it. ie. adding a bleed valve to the MAP sensor has "fooled"
the ECU into building more "peak" power... which provides "exciting" high
rev performance, but causes problems with over boost / ECU retarding
ignition, etc.
Adding spacers to the wastegate travel and allowing the wastegate to leak,
simply offsets the onset of overboost, and is bad for low end performance.
If you were to follow my recommendation in modifying the operation of the
wastegate, you could safely raise the stock peak boost to 15 psi, and you
would have faster onset of boost and peak boost at lower revs. Please
feedback that you understand the above... I hope I am not using too many
complicated words (I am involved in international technical trade, and I do
understand the problems in communicating in technical English)
John Gillon
www.clubsub.org.nz
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-
JohnnyG
Bleed valve
> I thought in a recent post that Miki stated he would like to run
> between 17-19psi which is why I suggested to still add a boost
> controller to the map sensor.
Yes, he is running abut 20 psi on an EJ20G, and having problems... more
because he is wasting potential boost with a leaking wastegate. He could
probably get closer and more safely to his target 250hp by better control of
the wategate, than by raising the peak boost alone.
John Gillon
www.clubsub.org.nz
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
> between 17-19psi which is why I suggested to still add a boost
> controller to the map sensor.
Yes, he is running abut 20 psi on an EJ20G, and having problems... more
because he is wasting potential boost with a leaking wastegate. He could
probably get closer and more safely to his target 250hp by better control of
the wategate, than by raising the peak boost alone.
John Gillon
www.clubsub.org.nz
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-
JohnnyG
Bleed valve
> "3.90 diffs (sealed road use)"
Whoops... I meant 4.111
John Gillon
www.clubsub.org.nz
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Whoops... I meant 4.111
John Gillon
www.clubsub.org.nz
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-
Miki
Bleed valve
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "JohnnyG" <grilla@i...> wrote:
>This modification defeats the objective of delaying the opening of
>the wastegate.... it only has a small postive impact on opening the
>wastegate earlier to relieve boost (but across the rev range, which
>is not good), and a bigger negative impact on building boost earlier
>... as the wastegate is always partly open and the turbo lagging in
>the low rev range. ie. leaking!
Yes John, this was the impact it had, that's why I put the bleed
valve on the MAP sensor and got rid of this... this... this "bad"
solution...
>It is possible that you could use the bleed valve that you currently
>have on the MAP sensor, and move it to the wastgate actuator. For a
>quick experiment...
Thought of this myself as well, but the hose to the wastegate
is "bigger" (!?) than the one that goes to the MAP sensor, so I tried
mounting it before the boost solenoid (which is the same size), but I
couldn't see any difference... well, the bleed valve is just 0.7 mm
though, so today I plan on trying it with a bigger "hole" to see if
it makes any difference, and of course I'll try to mount it on the
hose from the solenoid to the wastegate, cause that's what you meant
ay...
>1 : Remove the 1mm wastegate spacer plates and the MAP sensor bleed
>valve, and return to the stock setup, and you will probably have
>about 11-12 psi boost...
As said, I removed the plates earlier, but now, without any bleed
valve, the only difference is that now the boost is cut earlier,
at 'bout 16-17psi, which is acchieved quite rapidly... the Superships
chip has probably something to do with this ?
>4 : 20 psi boost (300+hp target) requires many "tweaks"...
I think that the current 261hp is enough (for now... heh heh),
keeping in mind that my car has already done 245.000km... Any more
mods should start with a complete "renovation" of the engine, to be
on the safe side, and that means a lot of money...
>Miki, I hope you understand my English, and your current EJ20G
>setup and the modifications to it. ie. adding a bleed valve to the
>MAP sensor has "fooled" the ECU into building more "peak" power...
>which provides "exciting" high rev performance, but causes problems
>with over boost / ECU retarding ignition, etc.
>Adding spacers to the wastegate travel and allowing the wastegate to
>leak, simply offsets the onset of overboost, and is bad for low end
>performance.
Yes John, I understand what you mean, and I fully agree, too.
>
>If you were to follow my recommendation in modifying the operation
>of the wastegate, you could safely raise the stock peak boost to 15
>psi, and you would have faster onset of boost and peak boost at
>lower revs. Please feedback that you understand the above...
Hmm, I again refer to the Superchips chip having some say here, but
I'll try to get the boost "under control" by mounting the bleed valve
you suggested...
>I hope I am not using too many complicated words...
No, I think I get it...
Thanks again John for helping me with this!
* Miki *
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>This modification defeats the objective of delaying the opening of
>the wastegate.... it only has a small postive impact on opening the
>wastegate earlier to relieve boost (but across the rev range, which
>is not good), and a bigger negative impact on building boost earlier
>... as the wastegate is always partly open and the turbo lagging in
>the low rev range. ie. leaking!
Yes John, this was the impact it had, that's why I put the bleed
valve on the MAP sensor and got rid of this... this... this "bad"
solution...
>It is possible that you could use the bleed valve that you currently
>have on the MAP sensor, and move it to the wastgate actuator. For a
>quick experiment...
Thought of this myself as well, but the hose to the wastegate
is "bigger" (!?) than the one that goes to the MAP sensor, so I tried
mounting it before the boost solenoid (which is the same size), but I
couldn't see any difference... well, the bleed valve is just 0.7 mm
though, so today I plan on trying it with a bigger "hole" to see if
it makes any difference, and of course I'll try to mount it on the
hose from the solenoid to the wastegate, cause that's what you meant
ay...
>1 : Remove the 1mm wastegate spacer plates and the MAP sensor bleed
>valve, and return to the stock setup, and you will probably have
>about 11-12 psi boost...
As said, I removed the plates earlier, but now, without any bleed
valve, the only difference is that now the boost is cut earlier,
at 'bout 16-17psi, which is acchieved quite rapidly... the Superships
chip has probably something to do with this ?
>4 : 20 psi boost (300+hp target) requires many "tweaks"...
I think that the current 261hp is enough (for now... heh heh),
keeping in mind that my car has already done 245.000km... Any more
mods should start with a complete "renovation" of the engine, to be
on the safe side, and that means a lot of money...
>Miki, I hope you understand my English, and your current EJ20G
>setup and the modifications to it. ie. adding a bleed valve to the
>MAP sensor has "fooled" the ECU into building more "peak" power...
>which provides "exciting" high rev performance, but causes problems
>with over boost / ECU retarding ignition, etc.
>Adding spacers to the wastegate travel and allowing the wastegate to
>leak, simply offsets the onset of overboost, and is bad for low end
>performance.
Yes John, I understand what you mean, and I fully agree, too.
>
>If you were to follow my recommendation in modifying the operation
>of the wastegate, you could safely raise the stock peak boost to 15
>psi, and you would have faster onset of boost and peak boost at
>lower revs. Please feedback that you understand the above...
Hmm, I again refer to the Superchips chip having some say here, but
I'll try to get the boost "under control" by mounting the bleed valve
you suggested...
>I hope I am not using too many complicated words...
No, I think I get it...
Thanks again John for helping me with this!
* Miki *
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-
JohnnyG
Bleed valve
> Thought of this myself as well, but the hose to the wastegate
> is "bigger" (!?) than the one that goes to the MAP sensor, so I tried
> mounting it before the boost solenoid (which is the same size), but I
> couldn't see any difference... well, the bleed valve is just 0.7 mm
> though, so today I plan on trying it with a bigger "hole" to see if
> it makes any difference, and of course I'll try to mount it on the
> hose from the solenoid to the wastegate, cause that's what you meant
> ay...
Kewl.... and it's "Eh? not... ay ...mounting the bleed valve before the
boost solenoid is also a solution, but generally the better practice seems
to be by bleeding closer to the wastegate actuator. The actual brand /
design of the bleed valve and it's consistent operation are issues, and they
can be tricky to set up correctly... I can't recommend a specific brand or
model at this moment, but I know that there are variables.
> As said, I removed the plates earlier, but now, without any bleed
> valve, the only difference is that now the boost is cut earlier,
> at 'bout 16-17psi, which is acchieved quite rapidly... the Superships
> chip has probably something to do with this ?
Oh... I forgot that you has Superchips which will provide quicker boost, but
maintains the stock boost cut setting.
I am not sure if the Superchips modifies the operation of the wategate, the
same as my recommended pneumatic (or electronic) boost control would... I
recollect and will try to find some comparison of various ROM / ECU swaps
which included Superchips... and if I remember correctly, the performance
improvement is in more "aggressive" air-fuel metering. The stock air-fuel
settings are very rich, as variable fuel quality and an overly lean setting
will quickly destroy a turbo engine.
I am fairly certain you will benefit from improved wastegate control, and
still use your Superchips. Improved wastegate control will build boost even
more "rapidly" with no boost-creep, and maintain peak boost without
overboost, to a peak boost level that is very close to the stock MAP sensor
/ boost cut.
However, just to add a new issue / gossip... I have heard one report of
owners not having any improvement with Superchips... and apparently
something to do with Superchips being an improvement on pre-92 ECU only?
> >4 : 20 psi boost (300+hp target) requires many "tweaks"...
>
> I think that the current 261hp is enough (for now... heh heh),
> keeping in mind that my car has already done 245.000km... Any more
> mods should start with a complete "renovation" of the engine, to be
> on the safe side, and that means a lot of money...
That is impressive mileage for a turbo... I am aiming for 400,000km before
the engine needs a re-ring or dumping, and to achieve this goal, my beastie
gets the very best of oils... Motul 300V. It is a very expensive 100%
ester-based oil, and after having seen the lack of wear in the cylinder bore
and the absolute cleanliness of the engine internals, I cannot recommend
it's performance strongly enough. I generally drive hard, and the high
temperature performance of Motul 300V is stunning! Oil is the key to
longevity....
> Hmm, I again refer to the Superchips chip having some say here, but
> I'll try to get the boost "under control" by mounting the bleed valve
> you suggested...
As above, I will check... I am fairly certain that Superchips tweak
air-fuel, and do not control boost operation.
John Gillon
www.clubsub.org.nz
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BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
> is "bigger" (!?) than the one that goes to the MAP sensor, so I tried
> mounting it before the boost solenoid (which is the same size), but I
> couldn't see any difference... well, the bleed valve is just 0.7 mm
> though, so today I plan on trying it with a bigger "hole" to see if
> it makes any difference, and of course I'll try to mount it on the
> hose from the solenoid to the wastegate, cause that's what you meant
> ay...
Kewl.... and it's "Eh? not... ay
...mounting the bleed valve before theboost solenoid is also a solution, but generally the better practice seems
to be by bleeding closer to the wastegate actuator. The actual brand /
design of the bleed valve and it's consistent operation are issues, and they
can be tricky to set up correctly... I can't recommend a specific brand or
model at this moment, but I know that there are variables.
> As said, I removed the plates earlier, but now, without any bleed
> valve, the only difference is that now the boost is cut earlier,
> at 'bout 16-17psi, which is acchieved quite rapidly... the Superships
> chip has probably something to do with this ?
Oh... I forgot that you has Superchips which will provide quicker boost, but
maintains the stock boost cut setting.
I am not sure if the Superchips modifies the operation of the wategate, the
same as my recommended pneumatic (or electronic) boost control would... I
recollect and will try to find some comparison of various ROM / ECU swaps
which included Superchips... and if I remember correctly, the performance
improvement is in more "aggressive" air-fuel metering. The stock air-fuel
settings are very rich, as variable fuel quality and an overly lean setting
will quickly destroy a turbo engine.
I am fairly certain you will benefit from improved wastegate control, and
still use your Superchips. Improved wastegate control will build boost even
more "rapidly" with no boost-creep, and maintain peak boost without
overboost, to a peak boost level that is very close to the stock MAP sensor
/ boost cut.
However, just to add a new issue / gossip... I have heard one report of
owners not having any improvement with Superchips... and apparently
something to do with Superchips being an improvement on pre-92 ECU only?
> >4 : 20 psi boost (300+hp target) requires many "tweaks"...
>
> I think that the current 261hp is enough (for now... heh heh),
> keeping in mind that my car has already done 245.000km... Any more
> mods should start with a complete "renovation" of the engine, to be
> on the safe side, and that means a lot of money...
That is impressive mileage for a turbo... I am aiming for 400,000km before
the engine needs a re-ring or dumping, and to achieve this goal, my beastie
gets the very best of oils... Motul 300V. It is a very expensive 100%
ester-based oil, and after having seen the lack of wear in the cylinder bore
and the absolute cleanliness of the engine internals, I cannot recommend
it's performance strongly enough. I generally drive hard, and the high
temperature performance of Motul 300V is stunning! Oil is the key to
longevity....
> Hmm, I again refer to the Superchips chip having some say here, but
> I'll try to get the boost "under control" by mounting the bleed valve
> you suggested...
As above, I will check... I am fairly certain that Superchips tweak
air-fuel, and do not control boost operation.
John Gillon
www.clubsub.org.nz
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
-
Miki
Bleed valve
--- In BC-BFLegacyWorks@egroups.com, "JohnnyG" <grilla@i...> wrote:
>...design of the bleed valve and it's consistent operation are
>issues, and they can be tricky to set up correctly...
Tried it today, but couldn't notice any difference... I removed
the "bleed valve" I had on the MAP sensor and put it to the hose that
goes from the boost solenoid to the wastegate actuator arm. The hole
(="bleed valve") is now the same size as the hole of the hose going
to the MAP sensor... how damn big does it have to be to work?
The boost cut seemed a bit higher than the 1.15-1.2bar it was without
it, I'd say it's about 1.3-1.35bar now... does this make any sence?
>However, just to add a new issue / gossip... I have heard one report
>of owners not having any improvement with Superchips...
To keep the gossip alive... my prevoius Legacy (also a '92) also had
the Superchips chip, but it still had the original exhaust. The
figures weren't that impressive... 216hp compared to the stock
200hp... With the original exhaust (and the chip) my current Legacy
showed 225hp on the dyno... just some figures if someone's
interested...
>...my beastie gets the very best of oils... Motul 300V.
Hmm, have to see if I can find it somewhere around here... it
probably costs VERY much here anyway... although you probably can't
comment on it's "behaviour" in temperatures below 0 degrees...
* Miki *
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BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>...design of the bleed valve and it's consistent operation are
>issues, and they can be tricky to set up correctly...
Tried it today, but couldn't notice any difference... I removed
the "bleed valve" I had on the MAP sensor and put it to the hose that
goes from the boost solenoid to the wastegate actuator arm. The hole
(="bleed valve") is now the same size as the hole of the hose going
to the MAP sensor... how damn big does it have to be to work?
The boost cut seemed a bit higher than the 1.15-1.2bar it was without
it, I'd say it's about 1.3-1.35bar now... does this make any sence?
>However, just to add a new issue / gossip... I have heard one report
>of owners not having any improvement with Superchips...
To keep the gossip alive... my prevoius Legacy (also a '92) also had
the Superchips chip, but it still had the original exhaust. The
figures weren't that impressive... 216hp compared to the stock
200hp... With the original exhaust (and the chip) my current Legacy
showed 225hp on the dyno... just some figures if someone's
interested...
>...my beastie gets the very best of oils... Motul 300V.
Hmm, have to see if I can find it somewhere around here... it
probably costs VERY much here anyway... although you probably can't
comment on it's "behaviour" in temperatures below 0 degrees...
* Miki *
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BC-BFLegacyWorks-unsubscribe@egroups.com