Got the Legacy back from the tuner...

[Legacy777]

After more than a year since I bought the Link it's finally in the car and "tuned". I picked it up today. There's some idle issues and other things I will take care of on my own. The HP/Torque numbers are a little misleading, due to the dyno being "acurate".

I made around 205 hp & 218 ft-lbs of torque at the wheels.

To give a better idea of those actual numbers. A stock WRX with 2.5 liter makes around 190-200 hp, and a stock STi makes around 220 hp. So I'm happy with the results for the most part.

As Dan has mentioned, go with as big of injectors as you can. I'm at the limit of the injectors, and probably near the limit of the turbo.

I will try and get the plots scanned tomorrow. Like I said, there's still some tweaking that needs to be done, so it's not quite done done....

[sqc151]

nice numbers.... whats ur mods?

[93forestpearl]

Good deal. Glad you are happy with the power results.

So this was on bone stock 22T heads, right? If so not bad at all. What's the power band look like? And yeah, the BSFC with the 22T heads is terrible. They take A LOT of fuel to make power.


The off-boost stuff should be easy, just a little time consuming. A codriver makes things go waaay faster.



Use that Zeitronix to it's full extent!!

[Legacy777]

nice numbers.... whats ur mods?

I need to put together a full list, but the basic power list is:

rebuilt ej22t (stock)
550 cc/min injectors
Deadbolt p&p TD05-16G
AWIC with custom pump & exchanger
MSD Dis 2 ignition
Link ECU
CES 3" TBE w/ high flow cat


I think that's the major stuff...

[Legacy777]

Good deal. Glad you are happy with the power results.

So this was on bone stock 22T heads, right? If so not bad at all. What's the power band look like? And yeah, the BSFC with the 22T heads is terrible. They take A LOT of fuel to make power.


The off-boost stuff should be easy, just a little time consuming. A codriver makes things go waaay faster.

Use that Zeitronix to it's full extent!!

Yeah, bone stock 22t heads to my knowledge. I had CCR in Colorado rebuild the heads. They may have altered the original grind of the valves slightly, but nothing notable done to them.

Here they are
http://www.main.experiencetherave.com/s ... s/ej22t/09

I'll get the plots scanned and posted.

[Legacy777]

Here are the dyno sheets

http://www.main.experiencetherave.com/s ... _dyno1.jpg
http://www.main.experiencetherave.com/s ... _dyno2.jpg
http://www.main.experiencetherave.com/s ... _dyno3.jpg


Interestingly enough, this tuner had a dyno day back in 2005. These are the numbers I ran on a vf11 and no intercooler.

Couldn't tell you though if the dynos were calibrated/reading the same though. I kind of would have expected more than a 50 hp gain from a TD05, AWIC, 550 injectors, & stand alone ecu....

http://www.main.experiencetherave.com/s ... gdyno1.jpg
http://www.main.experiencetherave.com/s ... gdyno2.jpg

[entirelyturbo]

?

50hp seems like a very reasonable amount to me. You increased your horsepower 33%. Regardless of how new your engine is, you're making stock STi hp out of a 20-year-old car. That's something to be proud of.

Also, would you rather make 50 more hp reliably, or 100 more hp and risk blowing your motor?

Edit: Dynamic Entry's math skills > my math skills. And to think I want to be an engineer!

[Legacy777]

Understand. I think my expectations may have been a little skewed.

[Dynamic Entry]

I would have felt the same way Josh.

I got the impression that a TD05 and it's support mods was a bit more radical than 50hp

although, that is actually a 33% increase

I suppose the real eye opener for me is that STis only actually put down 220..... that had escaped me somehow

[asc_up]

When you think about it, that turbo is the stock turbo on the early WRX STi's in Japan, and they were putting down right around the same HP.

My friend's EJ20G swap from a WRX Type RA STi had a TD05 that was pushing around 15PSI stock and when he dyno'd it, it put down 200WHP and something like 210WTQ. His car was damn quick too with the shorter RA gears. Easily pulled on USDM STi's.

Anyways, my point is that your car actually has a good deal of power relatively speaking. I'd be pretty happy! How much boost are you running right now? Any chance a front mount and some larger injectors could help you up the boost if needed?

[Legacy777]

I suppose the real eye opener for me is that STis only actually put down 220..... that had escaped me somehow

That's really going to depend on the dyno & how it's calibrated. On this dyno, that's what they say the STi's put down.

[Legacy777]

Anyways, my point is that your car actually has a good deal of power relatively speaking. I'd be pretty happy! How much boost are you running right now? Any chance a front mount and some larger injectors could help you up the boost if needed?

Power wise, I think I'll be happy. It's like anything, it's fine for a while then you want more My main concern now is the drivability of the car. It's not where I want it to be, and I will be working on correcting that.

Boost, I think they said it was running around 17 psi. The third dyno sheet confirms that.

Larger injectors would definitely help. That's pretty much what I was running out of. Turbo probably was near it's top end as well, but I'd have to look at turbo map to be sure of that.

I don't think a front mount would make that much if any difference. My AWIC setup is very robust, and should do pretty good.

[BSOD2600]

As Dan has mentioned, go with as big of injectors as you can. I'm at the limit of the injectors, and probably near the limit of the turbo.

How does one know the injectors are the limiting factor? Running 80+% duty cycle constantly? Lean (12.5+) AFR? other?

While your setup is slightly different than mine (tmic, 440cc, 15 PSI, etc), the ECU data logging I did makes me believe there is a decent amount of headroom for growth -- unless that ~2 PSI really makes a large difference in the upper end.

[asc_up]

Power wise, I think I'll be happy. It's like anything, it's fine for a while then you want more My main concern now is the drivability of the car. It's not where I want it to be, and I will be working on correcting that.

Boost, I think they said it was running around 17 psi. The third dyno sheet confirms that.

Larger injectors would definitely help. That's pretty much what I was running out of. Turbo probably was near it's top end as well, but I'd have to look at turbo map to be sure of that.

I don't think a front mount would make that much if any difference. My AWIC setup is very robust, and should do pretty good.

Haha I can totally understand that.

For what it's worth, my friend ended up going to a FMIC because it offered better cooling, therefore allowing him to run the turbo outside of its efficiency range. He ended up running around 22PSI with SARD 800cc injectors and the FMIC....safely.

[wtdash]

Josh,
When you dyno'd the VF11, it looks like stock boost, correct?
If so, since it's rated @ 160 Chp, 153 Whp seems a bit high.

Somewhere on here(?) I've seen 120-130ish HP is stock @ the wheels.

THISestimator states the same.

My point is that the Dyno may have been high in '05, so you're actually seeing a better improvement than it appears.

[BSOD2600]

When you dyno'd the VF11, it looks like stock boost, correct?
If so, since it's rated @ 160 Chp, 153 Whp seems a bit high.

Somewhere on here(?) I've seen 120-130ish HP is stock @ the wheels.

My stock dyno run (ok, everything stock except for MBC and ~10 PSI) was 136 HP

[93forestpearl]

How does one know the injectors are the limiting factor? Running 80+% duty cycle constantly? Lean (12.5+) AFR? other?

While your setup is slightly different than mine (tmic, 440cc, 15 PSI, etc), the ECU data logging I did makes me believe there is a decent amount of headroom for growth -- unless that ~2 PSI really makes a large difference in the upper end.

I was creeping up to almost 90% IDC at a base fuel pressure of 60psi, so I'd say I was at my injectors' limits, lol. Granted my turbo is significantly larger than Josh's, but it is frustrating when they are keeping you from exploiting your setup fully. Josh has all the same logging capabilitys I do.


Larger turbos often get more efficient as you raise the boost. On mine, the difference between 15 and 19 psi was not even close to the difference between 19 and 23 psi. This is often the case up to a certain point where you start to fall off the compressor map.



The day after you upsize your injectors, be wary of women in new Camrys.

[asc_up]

The day after you upsize your injectors, be wary of women in new Camrys.

Lol sad day

[Legacy777]

As Dan has mentioned, go with as big of injectors as you can. I'm at the limit of the injectors, and probably near the limit of the turbo.

How does one know the injectors are the limiting factor? Running 80+% duty cycle constantly? Lean (12.5+) AFR? other?

While your setup is slightly different than mine (tmic, 440cc, 15 PSI, etc), the ECU data logging I did makes me believe there is a decent amount of headroom for growth -- unless that ~2 PSI really makes a large difference in the upper end.

I was told by the tuner my injectors were at about 85% IDC. Sure I could bump the fuel pressure with a RRFPR or take the injectors past 85% IDC....but I probably would not have much control over things past there. That's why I made that statement.

When I start reviewing things in the ECU and do some logging, I'll be able to confirm or deny their claim about 85% IDC.

Boost really isn't the important number. It's mass air flow through the engine. Just because a vf11 can make 17 lbs of boost does not mean it will flow the same amount of air as a TD05-16G, etc.

[Legacy777]

Josh,
When you dyno'd the VF11, it looks like stock boost, correct?
If so, since it's rated @ 160 Chp, 153 Whp seems a bit high.

Somewhere on here(?) I've seen 120-130ish HP is stock @ the wheels.

THISestimator states the same.

My point is that the Dyno may have been high in '05, so you're actually seeing a better improvement than it appears.

Stock boost yes, but I also had LW flywheel, CES exhaust, and the MSD ignition. I don't know if those items would cause that much of an increase over stock..... Plus the run in 05 was during the winter time....so much cooler temps. I still question whether the dyno was calibrated the same....which is why I brought that point up.......who knows.

Dyno numbers are all relative for the most part. They're a good tool for measuring before and after changes within a day or so time difference (assuming weather conditions are same/similar)

[93forestpearl]

email replied.....

[douglas vincent]

550's should make close to 280-300whp @ 100% duty cycle, thats what mine did.

[93forestpearl]

^ On 22T heads?

[Legacy777]

Been doing a little reading and some light bulbs are going off. So I feel like I have a better grasp on things now.

Additionally, I am probably going to upgrade to the G4 ECU due to a known issue I have with the aux output on the ISC. The G2 & G3 ECU's can be upgraded to the G4 platform for a minimal cost. So I think I'm going to go that route, and then retune everything with hopefully the correct parameters inputted into the ECU.

Oh, here's the intake that the shop fabricated. They did a pretty good job with the intake. It's not the easiest to remove, but oh well. The BPV is definitely quite a bit louder without the silencer box on there.

http://www.main.experiencetherave.com/s ... install/13

[91legacyawdturbo]

Dont mean to hyjack a thread but how much does the link G4 cost??