Help with my Legacy, PLEASE!!

mikec · Post by **mikec** » Thu Jan 23, 2003 12:10 am

Hi Everyone,

I recently acquired a 1991 Legacy LS wagon, and was wondering what I should do to ensure everything's okay with it. I've already changed the oil (non-synthetic), oil filter (OEM), air filter and spark plugs, and was wondering what else I should look at (I'm going to get to the transmission fluid once it warms up a bit). I have no idea what its maintenance history is like. It currently has 223 500 km on it (about 139000 miles).

A problem I've had already happened this morning. I went out to start it and let it heat up (-20C outside), and noticed some blue smoke with the initial exhaust. It quickly cleared up, but I'm wondering if I should be really worried about this great deal that I got on the car. This is the first time I've noticed it, and I'm confused, because it did really well on the emissions test. When I got it, the oil read quite high on the dipstick, so I changed the oil as soon as I could. My brother thinks the piston rings may have been damaged, which would explain the smoke. Any thoughts from anyone?

Thanks in advance for any help anyone provides.

On a positive note, I'm glad I was able to get into the Subaru family with my first car, and I'm already counting the days until I can afford another!

ciper · Post by **ciper** » Thu Jan 23, 2003 1:51 am

You are either over due for a timing belt or the previous person was nice enough to do it already. Id suspect the latter.

Changing the timing belt involves clearing the front of the engine, so while you are at it think about replacing the oil pump water pump tensioner thermostat oil seals and drive belts.

I purchased a legacy that I planned to give to my mom. I replaced all the above mentioned items and the price was very good. Very small increase in labor for the additional parts. Using subaruparts.com the price for parts wasnt that bad either.

If you replaced all these items I have no doubt your engine would run easily until the next change interval.

You should also check your knock sensor to see if its the latest version. Check your CV joints for tears.

entirelyturbo · Post by **entirelyturbo** » Thu Jan 23, 2003 6:47 am

I'd be willing to say that with these engines, it's usually a top-end problem and not bottom-end. These are excellent, excellent engines, and you really have to ignore maintenance entirely and beat the heck out of it to ruin something like rings...

ciper, I am at 116K and I haven't changed the timing belt since I've had the car, so I presume that I should probably think about it come 120K. That said, how hard is it for a wannabe shadetree like myself with simple tools to do it? I understand the timing (BTW is the Haynes manual right with their timing mark diagrams?), but I really don't want to screw something up.

Also, let's say I do mess up the timing, these motors don't bend valves, do they

?

LegacyT · Post by **LegacyT** » Thu Jan 23, 2003 10:33 am

Nope, their not the later Phase II Interference motors.

Mark,

mikec · Post by **mikec** » Thu Jan 23, 2003 4:30 pm

So the piston rings are probably okay? That's a VERY comforting thing to hear. I had visions of becoming very poor very quickly as I tried to nurse this thing back to health.

3 more questions regarding the car:
1) I'm getting a code 35 (Canister Purge Solenoid Valve) when I start the car after its been driven for a bit (basically when its warm). Aside from replacing it outright, is there anything I can check. I saw another post about using penetrating oil, anybody think I should try this?

2) I've had a 10A fuse blow 3 times. Its in position 15, and according to the owner's manual, is for the "Meter". I've discovered that its referring to the warning lights, tach, temp and fuel gauge. My question is, should the power windows, moonroof and heater / fan controls also be affected by this simple 10A fuse? Because they are in my car. I'm wondering if something's been hooked up wrong some how, because I don't see how a single 10A fuse can handle all of that stuff.

3) The brake light on the dash likes to stay on until I've driven the car for a 1/2 hour or so, and started it 3 times. I saw a post about it possibly being the reservoir sensor (the brake reservoir is 1/2 full). How hard is it to check that its that sensor, and not the switch under the parking brake?

Sorry for all the questions, I'm getting some books in the very near future.

entirelyturbo · Post by **entirelyturbo** » Thu Jan 23, 2003 4:49 pm

The purge control valve...already had much experience with it, can tell you whatever you need to know...

Basically it controls when the engine accepts gas fumes from the charcoal canister. It's under the intake manifold on the left side, follow vacuum hoses from canister to it. I'll try to post some pics of it soon, I've been promising a lot of pics to this forum lately and not delivering

...

The bad news is: That part is non-serviceable, and must be replaced at a cost of approx. $80 just for the part. The good news: Your car will drive for another 160K km with that stupid thing not working, so it's no emergency. I drove mine for a year with that...

I'm not sure about your fuse problem...sounds like a short, but I'm not an electrician...

The brake light... Is yours a manual? If so, try adjusting your clutch cable. I know, everyone, makes no sense, but hold on. Us people with the NA 5spds got the Hill-Holder. If your cable is out of adjustment, your Hill-Holder will be too. Since that is tied to the brake system, that can affect things. Mine was horribly out of adjustment, and that fixed it

!

If that doesn't work, or if it's not a manual, check your parking brake adjustment, unfortunately that means tearing half the interior apart... Also, check your fluid (the 1/2 full thing may be it) and change it even...

mikec · Post by **mikec** » Thu Jan 23, 2003 5:02 pm

I'm pretty sure I've found the valve itself, and have definitely found the canister its connected to. But if its not going to affect the actual operation of the engine at all, well then, I guess I'll just have to stare at the check engine light whenever the car is warm!

And occasionally check the codes to make sure there's nothing else wrong.

I suspected a short too, but there's so many wires under the dash that I think I'd have to take the entire thing apart to possibly find it. Would anyone be interested in seeing if pulling their 10A in position 15 (marked Meter) affects the power windows or fan controls? I don't see how that much stuff could run through 1 fuse. Hopefully some wiring diagrams will shed some light on it when I can eventually get my hands on them.

I've got an automatic. I was thinking about the fluid level being it, but had read somewhere here that it was possible that the fluid sensor was acting up. But from what I understand so far, that would mean opening the reservoir, and having to replace the fluid. Or am I totally wrong about that? It's been so cold here this week that I haven't wanted to spend any amount of time outside working on it.

Again, thanks for all the help everyone!

ciper · Post by **ciper** » Thu Jan 23, 2003 7:44 pm

Most likely your purge valve will show zero continuity when tested. I have a replacement part that will work though if you want. Its not a direct replacement. I wrote a thread on it, ill search and post a link.

totech · Post by **totech** » Thu Jan 23, 2003 8:09 pm

I know a good dealer if you get stuck!

whitemr2 · Post by **whitemr2** » Thu Jan 23, 2003 10:08 pm

mikec wrote:1) I'm getting a code 35 (Canister Purge Solenoid Valve) when I start the car after its been driven for a bit (basically when its warm). Aside from replacing it outright, is there anything I can check. I saw another post about using penetrating oil, anybody think I should try this?

I just dealt with this on my '91. You can measure the resistance between the terminals, I think it's supposed to be 36 ohms. I bought a new part (~$100) and havn't seen the check engine light since. I would have just lived with the light, but I'm fighting a weird idle problem so wanted to rule out all possibilities...

mikec · Post by **mikec** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 12:23 am

I've actually discovered a weird idle problem too. When the engine is cold, it idles fine. After I've driven it for a while, it will occasionally idle rough, and it seems to get worse when I put into neutral. But I can never predict which stop light it will happen at. Sometimes its just enough to be noticeable, other times its enough that I can feel it.

whitemr2, is your weird idle problem anything like mine?

totech, is it an actual Subaru dealership? I've got one near by, but I'm wondering if there's anywhere cheaper in Southern Ontario that I might start looking for parts at.

entirelyturbo · Post by **entirelyturbo** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 1:34 am

Alright....I have done the idle problem thing, too. Check your plugs and wires, be especially sure that the wires aren't arcing which is my problem now. If that doesn't do it, check for the slightest vacuum leak...

If that doesn't do it, put it in Neutral, check your idle, and see if it goes up when you turn the a/c on. If it doesn't and goes lower , then your IAC valve is stuck. Try to find a junkyard one, a new one costs about $360

I know from personal experience...

Above all, do NOT touch your throttle body stopscrew, that is set from the factory and will give you problems if you adjust it...

Feel free to shoot any other questions regarding idle, I've been through the whole rigamarole of possible problems...

totech · Post by **totech** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 1:52 am

Mikec,

Yes, an actual Subaru Dealer, one that has about 10 BC/BF's for parts out back.

They have been looking after mine for a bit, and although I don't want to mention it - for fear of jinx - it is running the best it ever had.

Tell me if you need more..

Post by **Legacy777** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 2:10 am

Sometimes you can take the solenoid out and clean it with some brake cleaner or something......sometimes gets things working again.

mikec · Post by **mikec** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 2:49 am

Wow guys, thanks for all the help! Now if only it wasn't -25 celcius with the windchill, I'd be able to spend some time under the hood. I'll try to check for arcing this weekend, and see if I can check the resistance of the solenoid. Regarding the arcing, do I just check at the spark plug end? If not, how do I get that decorative plastic cover off the top of the engine? I haven't looked too closely at it yet, to be perfectly honest.

And it sounds like I might be making a trip out to Ajax in the near future!

totech · Post by **totech** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 3:13 am

The fancy engine cover just pulls off - push pins? attach it in 4 locations.

Yeah it is cold.......

I am downtown TO most days - if you like we could meet and you can see how my BF idles.

Andrew

totech · Post by **totech** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 3:15 am

Ajax is not too far...

Andrew

mikec · Post by **mikec** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 3:33 am

I didn't want to just start pulling. Maybe I'll check the spark plug wires at that end once its a bit warmer out.

Thanks for the offer, I'll have to take you up on it one day (again, when its a bit warmer out!

)

entirelyturbo · Post by **entirelyturbo** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 5:56 am

I just had an interesting situation today. I pulled my #4 wire off the coilpack and found the connector pushed all the way back into the plug, and covered in carbon deposits. Connectors aren't exposed to the elements, so if your connector just plain looks bad, you're arcing. I'll be sure to have some pics of what mine looks like very soon...

Check both ends of the wire too...

The trim piece just comes off. Might take a little effort...

mikec · Post by **mikec** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 2:51 pm

Maybe I will check them today then, regardless of the temperature. I also think I'm going to look at maybe getting some replacement wires. I think whoever had the car before changed them, but I've never heard of the company before (starts with a Y).

Any recommendations for new ones? I noticed a lot of people seem to like the NGK wires.

Post by **Legacy777** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 3:18 pm

I like my magnecor's

whitemr2 · Post by **whitemr2** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 8:19 pm

mikec wrote:I've actually discovered a weird idle problem too. When the engine is cold, it idles fine. After I've driven it for a while, it will occasionally idle rough, and it seems to get worse when I put into neutral. But I can never predict which stop light it will happen at. Sometimes its just enough to be noticeable, other times its enough that I can feel it.

whitemr2, is your weird idle problem anything like mine?

I don't think so. Mine is a very predictable bouncing idle...slightly worse when cold but always repeatable. The idle bounces a few times; the car struggles to maintain a steady idle so overshoots each way a few times until it stabilizes at about 700rpm (at which point it seems it be idling a little rough). This happens when shifting into P, happens mildly when going to R or D, and happens when the car downshifts from 2 to 1 at 15mph. If I'm braking hard enough and come to a stop before the idle has stabilized, the car can (and has) sometimes stall. Once the idle has stabilized, it's fine.

I replaced plugs, wires, and fuel filter, but no change in idle performance. So, I'm guessing that in my case, my idle speed valve is probably dirty and not operating smoothly.

ciper · Post by **ciper** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 9:46 pm

Bouncing idle is an IAC problem.

vrg3 · Post by **vrg3** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 9:49 pm

mikec wrote:I've actually discovered a weird idle problem too. When the engine is cold, it idles fine. After I've driven it for a while, it will occasionally idle rough, and it seems to get worse when I put into neutral. But I can never predict which stop light it will happen at. Sometimes its just enough to be noticeable, other times its enough that I can feel it.

Wow, you just described my idling problem pretty well!

My suspicion is that it's misfiring at idle because of a vacuum leak making it run lean. I base this partly on the observation that if I create a bigger vacuum leak I get what seems to be the same problem but amplified, and on the observation that the emissions equipment used in the state of Virginia can detect no hydrocarbons at all coming out of my car's tailpipe at idle. I did kind of mask the problem a little when I installed the MSD ignition; I guess that's because it makes the bad mixture more likely to burn anyway.

It could be a weird sensor or something too though... I notice sometimes when I'm coasting to a stop with the clutch pedal down, the idle is okay until I actually stop. After I stop it roughens up... the only difference in those situation is really the vehicle speed sensor's reading.

mikec · Post by **mikec** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 10:46 pm

vrg3, if you've noticed it too, and discovered that vaccuum has an effect on it, is it possible that the canister purge valve could actually be involved? I know that I keep getting a CEL when I start it after its warm, and that the code is for the valve. I'm going to check on the valve this weekend, and see if I can figure out if its stuck open or closed.

Come to think of it, I think my car also did really well on the emissions test up here during idle too. Hmm....

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A forum for 89-94 BC-BF(BJ) Legacy Owners and Fans

Help with my Legacy, PLEASE!!

Help with my Legacy, PLEASE!!