Any "common" Subaru fuel rails that will fit 22T injectors?

[kookookachew]

So, I've searched and couldn't exactly find what I'm looking for. But if I missed it just let me know please.

Anyway, heres the background. I'm planning on doing a turbo build to my now N/A '93 L. I was planning on following meyagi's "Ken Block" budget Impreza beater build by means of running the N/A block with EJ251 SOHC heads for lower compression and a turbo ECU. I've gotten all of the parts other than a turbo and fuel management. (I've picked up a turbo MAF, manifold, DP. cat-back etc etc)

From what I understand the SOHC heads will require a SOHC intake manifold which I could use the original N/A one? But I'm trying to figure out how to run the turbo Legacy injectors. I could just buy turbo fuel rails from someone on here, but I imagine at a premium, and then they have to be shipped etc. At my local junkyards I can pull rails for just a couple of dollars, so I was curious if the fuel rail design for the 2.2T is the same as any of the more common newer NA Subarus? There hundreds of Imprezas, Legacys, Outbacks and Foresters all within an hour from me just ripe for the picking at various U-Pull-it yards. So are there any fuel rails that will accept the turbo injectors and bolt to an N/A 2.2 Manifold?

Any help is greatly appreciated. Thanks a ton guys!

[BoostedSubie]

The EJ251 heads use a different bolt pattern for the intake manifold than the 2.2 you have, you will need to use the manifold for those heads which uses top feed injectors so you won't be able to use the EJ22t injectors. You could use the 02-05 wrx injectors which are top feed but are 440cc and the EJ22t are 380cc so it would run rich with the EJ22t ecu unless you run a piggyback or look into using a EJ20g ecu. The EJ20g uses 440s. I may be forgetting something but I'm sure others will chime in with advice.

[kookookachew]

Hmm, not what I wanted to hear So in Meyagi's build that I read on mainlysubarus he mentioned using a 2.2 manifold from a '00 OBS on his 2.5L heads. So I'm assuming then that those newer 2.2Ls are a different bolt pattern as well?

Anyway, does anyone know of any 370cc topfeed injectors that could be used? I'm trying to keep the budget reasonable so I'd rather not invest in a piggy back ($400+ I imagine?) since I'm only interested in a low-boost build, (8psi max) If I could hit 175-200 wheel reliably, I'd be super happy. I'm only running 209 wheel according to the dyno in my 150K '06 LGT and that is plenty for me, if I want real power I'll work with the properly turbo-charged car...

Also, if I were to wire in an Ej20G ECU, I'm not really afraid of the wiring as long as I can get some good schematics/diagrams to cross-reference. But I imagine that the engine side would be a b*$# since most of the sensors would need to be swapped out? I suppose one big side to using one of those would be the ability to open-source tune...

[kookookachew]

On a separate note, are EJ22T Injectors high or low impedance? I've read some Nissan topfeeds from a CA18DET from an S13 are 370cc and low impedance.

There are also some top feeds from a 3000GT/Stealth Turbo that are 360cc topfeeds and low impedance. I'll have to do some reading on using non-Subaru injectors though...

[BoostedSubie]

The EJ20g is actually super easy, almost all the pins are the same and you don't need to change anything on the engine harness. Here are two good threads on adapting an EJ20g ecu. You can do a search to find any more info on it.

http://bbs.legacycentral.org/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=43959
http://bbs.legacycentral.org/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=47252

[BoostedSubie]

Oh, and the stock injectors are high impedance

[kookookachew]

Ok awesome, thanks for those. Its been some very good reading. Definitely seems like it could be an option depending on the cost.

I know this may sound like a dumb question, but is there any decent places to get an EJ20G ECU? Or would I just have to scour the forums for one? Oh, and what would be the going rate for them? I've found one for sale on eBay, but it was over $300 just for the ECU, and I know eBays prices can be crap on those kind of things sometimes.

[wtdash]

HI,

I'm going to suggest you look into just turboing the stock NA EJ22, since you're not wanting high boost. There is a member (not on here much anymore) named Reddevil who has done it w/some success. If you search on RS25.com and on here, there are some who just run a small turbo @ WG boost - 5-7psi - and have for many miles - w/the stock NA ECU.

You can run a stock EJ22T ECU, which is not hard to wire in - more info HERE to assist. And they go for about $50 on here. You could just use the stock EJ22T injectors and rails on the SOHC IM.

And add a turbo crossmember to your list, unless you want to notch the stock one, for the up-pipe off the exhaust manifold....unless you're going "custom".

BTW, there are what are called Phase 1 and Phase 2 EJ-series engines. Phase 1 were the EJ18, EJ22e, EJ22T (SOHC) and EJ25D (DOHC) and IM's don't interchange, which is '90-'98. The Phase 2 were '99+ for the EJ222 and EJ25x - NA engines, and IM's do interchange. The EJ2xx DOHC turbo engines IM's don't interchange w/the NA, IIRC.



.........
EJ20G ECUs can found on NASIOC sometimes and you'll find them readily on Ebay.uk.com. Email the Seller to confirm they'll ship to the US and how much....shipping can be $$.

I've bought 2 of them from the UK and they were about $125 shipped, IIRC.

If you use an Ej20G ECU you'll be limited to the 440/450cc injectors. These were gray side-feeds from the UK/JDM cars and only fit the EJ22T rails, IIRC. They are originally from a DOHC fuel rail which do NOT fit the SOHC (Yeah...there are SOHC and DOHC rails to be aware of too).

I don't know about the newer '02+ WRX 440 top-feed injectors and what rails they require, but they used a different fuel rail system on the newer stuff.

TD

[kookookachew]

Ok awesome info, thanks a bunch, its unbelievably helpful to have someone actually confirm something instead of just reading countless threads. I had just assumed that despite the few peple that have done it, running the EJ22e with its original heads would be asking for trouble in terms of reliability due to it being high compression, even under lower boost.

I already have a 22T ECU and all of the FSM pages referencing the wiring and yes that looks pretty easy to do, I have a turbo manifold, up-pipe, DP, cat-back, WRX intercooler and hood-scoop and Turbo Hitachi MAF for the build.

So, if running the stock heads will be fine than I'll just freshen up the original heads when I pull the motor and go with a set of turbo fuel-rails and injectors. I'll probably end up running a newer TD04 with the lower waste-gate pressure or maybe even a VF11 if I can find one in good shape, and I will be notching the cross-member, I have a buddy whos excited to help, and a very good welder so thats all settled as well.

Again, thank you for the help, I've been doing ALOT of reading on this build, along with the manual swap thats to come as well, for a couple of months now and I've learned an incalculable amount of stuff. However all the reading in the world and I'm still a little weak on the subject simply due to lack of experience, and lack of actually talking personally to anybody whos been through the process. But the following months will change that!

[Legacy777]

I would not recommend using the 02+ WRX top feed injectors. As well as flowing more than the stock 370's they also are going to have different latency values. While they will like work and actuate, the fuel delivery timing could be off which will affect AFR's. If they were side feed, I'd feel more comfortable about it, but side feed and top feed injectors are completely different designs.

[kookookachew]

Ahh, ok, I've just seen a build where they worked really well. Heres a link to his build thread if you happen to be interested...

http://www.mainelysubarus.com/forums/to ... awhp-8psi/

Looks like I wont have to touch WRX injectors now anyway if I can get away with my stock heads and using Legacy turbo injectors and rails I'll be much happier this way as well since there will be less cobbling together with crazy calibrators and such, I can just let the ECU handle things like it was meant to...

[Legacy777]

Well....they may work...I can't argue if it's been done, but can't say for sure whether the latency values are the same/similar.

I agree sticking with the older ej22 heads is probably a better route.

[kookookachew]

Haha I have no real knowledge on the comparison of the injectors either, I was just trying to follow in the steps of someones proven successful, well-documented build.

But I'm defintiely happy about being able to stick with the original heads, like I said it saves me some head-aches, keeps everything simpler, and you can't forget the the ribbed valve covers are wayy better looking!