So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
Moderators: Helpinators, Moderators
-
- First Gear
- Posts: 91
- Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2010 8:41 pm
So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
SO ive been looking in to upgrading my stock turbo and injectors so i can finaly throw my 07 TMIC on. But since revtronix is nolonger.. what should i get. Ive hear alot of talk of a TD04 and a TD05 With 440's... Whats the average cost/performance gain? I know ill need a MBC, already have apexi intake and HKS 3"DP. So i ask.... Whats the best bang for the buck
-
- Fifth Gear
- Posts: 6322
- Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:17 am
- Location: Lakewood, Wa 98439
- Contact:
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
there's a fellow member running a td05 w/ 440s and he gets around 270hp, me and my friend estimate i get about 205ho w/ my td04 & 440s @ 16lbs.
91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
I run a td05-16g on 550's, fmic and aftermarket ecu. It was dynoed 294/293 a couple of weeks ago and there is still more left in it. I had a 99 impreza earlier with a td04 @ ~20 psi and dynoed 267/261. (both on crank)
The td04 kicks in much earlier and builds boost a lot faster, but the td05 is much easier to drive on a daily basis. It hits max boost later obviously and it builds boost slower, so it never comes as a surprise. You can drive it off boost without problems or you can kick it and stay within boost through gears.
The impreza was harder to drive slow, because you'd hit max boost just before shifting. I haven't tried the td05 on track yet, so no comparison there, but I would assume it is easier to control aswell as you have alot more rpms to work with while building boost. Also the td04 drops in pressure a lot earlier than the td05, which can almost hold 22psi through to redline.
I was afraid to be suffering from turbo lag when going from a td04/tmic to td05/fmic, but I'll have to admit it suits me a lot better.
I have no idea about cost or what to do if you stick with the stock ecu. I would expect the td05 route to be more expensive.
The td04 kicks in much earlier and builds boost a lot faster, but the td05 is much easier to drive on a daily basis. It hits max boost later obviously and it builds boost slower, so it never comes as a surprise. You can drive it off boost without problems or you can kick it and stay within boost through gears.
The impreza was harder to drive slow, because you'd hit max boost just before shifting. I haven't tried the td05 on track yet, so no comparison there, but I would assume it is easier to control aswell as you have alot more rpms to work with while building boost. Also the td04 drops in pressure a lot earlier than the td05, which can almost hold 22psi through to redline.
I was afraid to be suffering from turbo lag when going from a td04/tmic to td05/fmic, but I'll have to admit it suits me a lot better.
I have no idea about cost or what to do if you stick with the stock ecu. I would expect the td05 route to be more expensive.
Subaru Legacy Turbo 1992 - it's alive (but not done). VEMS ecu, 6mt, Wiseco/Eagle internals, Hybrid GT FMIC, 550cc, TD05 Big 16g @ 22psi, dynoed 294/293.
Now being parted out
Now being parted out
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
I'd suggest figuring out your engine management first, as you will not get the most out of the other mods. There's a post in the electrical forum about "Rob Tunes". He is working on a similar setup to what revtronix provided.
Josh
surrealmirage.com/subaru
1990 Legacy (AWD, 6MT, & EJ22T Swap)
2020 Outback Limted XT
If you need to get a hold of me please email me rather then pm
surrealmirage.com/subaru
1990 Legacy (AWD, 6MT, & EJ22T Swap)
2020 Outback Limted XT
If you need to get a hold of me please email me rather then pm
-
- First Gear
- Posts: 91
- Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2010 8:41 pm
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
Egine management has been my only down fall thus far... After revtronix died we as a community are in need of a replacement. Ive done some snooping in to this "Robs Tune" but so far he is not offering anything that we can use.. Isnt there anyone outhere that can take revtronix place?
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
Sure, but not 'plug and play' like either an ECU or chip upgrade. Piggy backs and Stand-alones are other EM options.HandleWitCare wrote:Egine management has been my only down fall thus far... After revtronix died we as a community are in need of a replacement. Ive done some snooping in to this "Robs Tune" but so far he is not offering anything that we can use.. Isnt there anyone outhere that can take revtronix place?
Unfortunately, due to the EJ22T's limited use (only in the US) and short build dates - '91-94 - the small customer base makes it hard for a vendor to justify spending much on support.
Turbo Subies:
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T
-
- First Gear
- Posts: 91
- Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2010 8:41 pm
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
So my best bet is to just enjoy what i have for now.. and save my money for a newer suby/or a hybrid build with my ej22t block? This is dissapointing due to how fun these cars are.. and i thought i had a great base to build from.. once again skunked.....
-
- First Gear
- Posts: 91
- Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2010 8:41 pm
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
Just to let everyone know.. I FINALY Brought my 91 SS Back to LIFE!!!!!! Just got my 200 dollar coolant fill tank and turbo inlet elbow from Subaru... Back to stock... Finaly Now i can start to have fun!!!! MOD TIME!!!!!!
-
- First Gear
- Posts: 198
- Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2009 11:28 am
- Location: Clatskanie, Or
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
Just to be clear, our cars can handle a vf-39 or td05-16g with stock internals right? But its a good idea to put in some 2.5 heads?
i know you need an intercooler, injectors, jecs maf, engine management.
Just making sure the stock internals can handle it..
i know you need an intercooler, injectors, jecs maf, engine management.
Just making sure the stock internals can handle it..
1992 legacy SS 5mt, Winestone Metallic.
-
- Fifth Gear
- Posts: 6322
- Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:17 am
- Location: Lakewood, Wa 98439
- Contact:
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
18 lbs in my car seems to be doing fine with 440s & vf39
91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
-
- First Gear
- Posts: 198
- Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2009 11:28 am
- Location: Clatskanie, Or
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
Good to knowcj91legss wrote:18 lbs in my car seems to be doing fine with 440s & vf39
1992 legacy SS 5mt, Winestone Metallic.
-
- Fifth Gear
- Posts: 6322
- Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:17 am
- Location: Lakewood, Wa 98439
- Contact:
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
keep in mind, every car is different.
91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
-
- First Gear
- Posts: 198
- Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2009 11:28 am
- Location: Clatskanie, Or
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
true. what are you using for EM?
1992 legacy SS 5mt, Winestone Metallic.
-
- Fifth Gear
- Posts: 6322
- Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:17 am
- Location: Lakewood, Wa 98439
- Contact:
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
stock ecu right now.
91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
-
- First Gear
- Posts: 198
- Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2009 11:28 am
- Location: Clatskanie, Or
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
and she runs pretty much fine?
1992 legacy SS 5mt, Winestone Metallic.
-
- Fifth Gear
- Posts: 6322
- Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:17 am
- Location: Lakewood, Wa 98439
- Contact:
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
little rich at the moment, but pulls alright
91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
-
- Fifth Gear
- Posts: 8360
- Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2006 3:41 am
- Location: Tenino, WA
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
CJ do you have an AFR gauge hooked up yet though? I wouldn't run anything over stock without an AFR gauge.
98 Metro Hatch Daily Driver :)
91 SS EJ20G Engine/Tranny/Diff Swap Build Thread Here
"Your testes are close to your bottom but you still play with them all the time." Jeremy Clarkson
91 SS EJ20G Engine/Tranny/Diff Swap Build Thread Here
"Your testes are close to your bottom but you still play with them all the time." Jeremy Clarkson
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
A little slow to respond...but after adding a piggy-back to my other Subie (not my Legacy w/the Rev chip), I'd suggest doing some more research on EM options.HandleWitCare wrote:So my best bet is to just enjoy what i have for now.. and save my money for a newer suby/or a hybrid build with my ej22t block? This is dissapointing due to how fun these cars are.. and i thought i had a great base to build from.. once again skunked.....
You DO have a great base to build from....These cars are probably one of the most over-built/under-utilized platforms out there.
I'm not going name a number, but the block is very solid. No, the heads don't flow like a DOHC, but Legacy777 made 250+ WHP w/them (STi's are about 240-ish WHP), which is DOUBLE the stock HP on those stock heads. And although the pistons aren't forged....it's not a big deal if you tune it correctly - and don't go crazy w/boost.
For the cost of few tuner books, the piggy-back, wide-band, knock-light and even a couple of hours @ a tuner, if needed, you're still way ahead of buying a new(er) car, and you'll be looking @ 'em in the rear-view.
So, in case I wasn't clear, YOU DO have a great base to build from!
GL,
TD
Last edited by wtdash on Tue Sep 07, 2010 5:09 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Turbo Subies:
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
LookAsubie wrote:Just to be clear, our cars can handle a vf-39 or td05-16g with stock internals right? But its a good idea to put in some 2.5 heads?
i know you need an intercooler, injectors, jecs maf, engine management.
Just making sure the stock internals can handle it..
You'll hear this more than you want....IT'S IN THE TUNE. As I said above I'm not going to name #'s as I really don't know, but I highly doubt either of those turbos w/440-550cc injectors will max out the EJ22T w/a PROPER TUNE.
The heads will give you about 20% more flow. I'm not sure how that translates into HP/Torque, as it's not a straight across 20% more of each.
GL,
TD
Turbo Subies:
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T
-
- First Gear
- Posts: 198
- Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2009 11:28 am
- Location: Clatskanie, Or
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
Thank you sir.wtdash wrote:LookAsubie wrote:Just to be clear, our cars can handle a vf-39 or td05-16g with stock internals right? But its a good idea to put in some 2.5 heads?
i know you need an intercooler, injectors, jecs maf, engine management.
Just making sure the stock internals can handle it..
You'll hear this more than you want....IT'S IN THE TUNE. As I said above I'm not going to name #'s as I really don't know, but I highly doubt either of those turbos w/440-550cc injectors will max out the EJ22T w/a PROPER TUNE.
The heads will give you about 20% more flow. I'm not sure how that translates into HP/Torque, as it's not a straight across 20% more of each.
GL,
TD
1992 legacy SS 5mt, Winestone Metallic.
-
- Fifth Gear
- Posts: 6322
- Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:17 am
- Location: Lakewood, Wa 98439
- Contact:
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
kimokalihi wrote:CJ do you have an AFR gauge hooked up yet though? I wouldn't run anything over stock without an AFR gauge.
Nope
91 L-TW Wagon with a full Swap -RIP
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
92 SS Prefaced, GD dash swapped, 22T/205 Hybrid 20 psi - BEAST!
93 SS Bone Stock Gone!
94 TW Bone Stock Gone!
91 SS 4EAT Sold!
98 LGT 4EAT
98 LGT Wagon 4EAT
-
- First Gear
- Posts: 91
- Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2010 8:41 pm
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
Well sorry i took so long to get back.... Sadlley I got laid off today.. so untill I get a jobby I cant do any purchasing.. but I can Learn more about this EM problem.
Dash,
Thank you for the info... Im relived to hear that when buying the car the feeling of the car being underrated was true... So again thank you
Everyone Else,
Which seems like the better option for daily driving when it comes to EM? Also if im goin to have to find a tuner.. should i just have them do it all or can i realy get it done my self? I mean when it comes to PC's thats what i do so i figure my laptop some software, and the right hardware should do the trick, Now its time to find where to get the hardware.... Any suggestions?
Dash,
Thank you for the info... Im relived to hear that when buying the car the feeling of the car being underrated was true... So again thank you
Everyone Else,
Which seems like the better option for daily driving when it comes to EM? Also if im goin to have to find a tuner.. should i just have them do it all or can i realy get it done my self? I mean when it comes to PC's thats what i do so i figure my laptop some software, and the right hardware should do the trick, Now its time to find where to get the hardware.... Any suggestions?
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
Sorry to hear about you losing your job.
When it comes to tuning, you may be able to setup the I/O and what not in the EM, but unless you have a good understanding of engines and tuning, I'd probably suggest you let the tuner do the tuning.
When it comes to tuning, you may be able to setup the I/O and what not in the EM, but unless you have a good understanding of engines and tuning, I'd probably suggest you let the tuner do the tuning.
Josh
surrealmirage.com/subaru
1990 Legacy (AWD, 6MT, & EJ22T Swap)
2020 Outback Limted XT
If you need to get a hold of me please email me rather then pm
surrealmirage.com/subaru
1990 Legacy (AWD, 6MT, & EJ22T Swap)
2020 Outback Limted XT
If you need to get a hold of me please email me rather then pm
-
- First Gear
- Posts: 91
- Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2010 8:41 pm
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
Ok so heres the update..... I have since had my stock turbo go out.. So since that i picked up a 06 TDO4 from a buddy of mine out here in the STL It had just over 15K on it in awesome shape for $170 and he brought it to me I got a Samco ypipe kit and picked up some grimm speed gaskets and a wrx bpv. Im waiting on my 90 for the inlet which should be here today. So when i get it running again i ll get picks.... Im running stock ECU and Injectors/Maf. I plan on running waste gate pressure.(TD04) Which i believe is 10psi? I have no MBC yet so i dont know what i should do? Plus i got a job not much but a job.. .so soon for the other parts i hope.. for now i just need a car.
Re: So whats the best Turbo/Injector Combo?
I'm running the TD04 w/the stock injectors, ECU, TMIC and BCS - no MBC. I also have a 3" DP. I get a little more PSI out of it - 10-11 psi - which I feel is safe and doesn't hit the fuel cut @ 13psi.
There were a couple different WG's on the TD04....I think 10 and 14 psi? So, if you don't have a boost gauge - GET ONE - so you know what the TD04 is doing.
TD
There were a couple different WG's on the TD04....I think 10 and 14 psi? So, if you don't have a boost gauge - GET ONE - so you know what the TD04 is doing.
TD
Turbo Subies:
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T
'87 GL-10 Turbo - SOLD
'90 BJ EJ22T/DOHC & 5speed swap - SOLD
'04 FXT, Forged internals, VF39, STI TMIC, Cobb AP- SOLD
'93 Legacy SS - 5-speed, SOLD :-(
'02 WRX -SOLD
'96 BD-turbo'd-SOLD
'98 SF - NA-T